Commissioner Kelly Fraasch has updated her blog in time for tomorrow's commission meeting.
2014 Budget has links to the 2014 Recommended Budget and the Amendments to the 2014 Recommended Budget.
Why I voted No on Bendel's Proposal for Turf? Kelly discusses her concerns with the Turf Proposal for Middle and Wildcat Fields.
Kelly has been working on a non-lethal deer management option, sterilization. Deer in Mt. Lebanon Part 3 Biologists are learning that this method is extremely successful.
Thanks Kelly, for keeping us informed.
Is there any other Commissioner that works to communicate with (and represent) the ENTIRE community and not just their inner circle?
ReplyDeleteNope.
Thanks Kelly.
Here's the thing. She actually took a position and put it out there. Even if I disagree with her on the culling, at least I understand she has been working on the issue and that she has a defensible stance.
ReplyDeleteWith the deer (I can't WAIT to stop talking about deer) there are people who want to eliminate them now at any cost just to show a reduction in numbers no matter how temporary that reduction might be. For me, I had no idea that this sterilization program was a possibility and after being introduced to it by Kelly, I actually think it is the best long-term way to address the issue at no physical risk to residents.
The next step for the commission is to outline the costs of such a program.
On the turf deal, it has been said here before, the B&B boys totally pulled the rug out from under the Robb Hollow project. I was legitimately shocked at how they snowballed Kelly (and the community) on that one.
Want to hear a funny, 8:49 AM? We can complain to the commissioners how they snowballed us during the public hearing tonight.
ReplyDeleteElaine
All hail Kelly! Kelly can do no wrong, can she? Not according to this blog, at least.
ReplyDeleteMany in this town recognize that this blog functions as Kelly's unofficial blog. Obviously she has her "official" blog, but this one lets her perpetuate and foster agendas that would be unpopular or off-limits in her official capacity as a commissioner.
Cheerleader posts like this one just establish it even more. Why don't you do a cheerleader post for Kristin Linfante? Oh, that's right. It's because you and Kelly can't stand her.
Anyway, the gig is up. You might as well rename this blog "Elaine & Kelly's lebocitizens blog: our way or the highway!"
Really 11:21, if we disagree with Linfante or Brumfield or Bendel we must bow to them?
ReplyDeleteThis resident didn't agree with Kelly's sterilization plan, but it's beginning to make more sense than culling, which doesn't really work.
On the budget, I wish she'd protest more against the spending.
On her field plan, it at least offers some improvements and recreation alternatives for residents other than kids. I like the walking/jogging path idea and would like to see it developed further.
She knows she's royalty, unlike some other people one could mention.
Methinks you need some anger management counseling 11:21.
But of course, it's not "Our way or the highway" for Linfante, Brumfield, Bendel or Franklin!
ReplyDeleteCorrection:
ReplyDeleteShe knows she's NOT royalty, unlike some other people one could mention.
Yeah, I'm busted. How do you explain the fact that I was the first to publish John Bendel's Field Enhancement Proposal? What about the YSA Turf Presentation from June 2012? YSA Proposal I was the first to publish that. Then there is Kristen's Deer Management Proposal from October 9, 2012.
ReplyDeleteAs far as agreeing or disagreeing with the commissioners, I disagree with both Kelly and Kristen about PAYT. I was extremely disappointed that Kelly voted for the pool. Incidentally, I agreed with Kristen about dogs in Williamsburg Park. I had expressed my surprise during a commission meeting that Kristen and I were actually on the same side of an issue, for once. That is when Dave Brumfield asked Kristen if she wanted to switch sides concerning Williamsburg. I would love to do a cheerleading post for her and the rest of the commissioners, if I agreed with their decisions. I have posted many "cheerleader" posts about Dan Miller and Matt Kluck.
You obviously have issues with Kelly Fraasch, 11:21 AM. Get help.
Elaine
I think Elaine would post anything from any commissioner if they wanted to express their point of view.
ReplyDeleteIt just is a fact that Kelly is the only one that maintains an active blog where she publishes ideas.
I think it is funny, 11:21, that you criticize Kelly for putting her ideas out there where Elaine can link them instead of criticizing other commissioners for not making their opinions available.
For years the YSA/SAB sing song has been "not enough fields!" "our fields are being overused!"
ReplyDeleteSo Kelly comes up with a plan that gives them exactly what they asked for - more fields.
So what happens next? The SAB actually comes out and declares, "we really don't want more fields, we want to turf an existing field!"
Brumfield's reasoning for it has nothing to do with expanding game capacity. The important thing is image. The pitch, the justification, if you're foolish enough to believe it, is that turf will keep housing values high.
It's hogwash of course and now they're once again taking pot shots at an elected official that doesn't play their game.
Sad that people aren't following this.
re: 2:01 PM - "..hogwash" you say? Is that the limit of your imagination! It's more like elephant herd-wash!
ReplyDeletehog·wash (hôgwôsh, -wsh, hg-)
ReplyDeleten.
1. Worthless, false, or ridiculous speech or writing; nonsense.
2. Garbage fed to hogs; swill.
I think hogwash pretty much covers it, according to the definition of the term from The Online Dictionary.
I still can't understand the obsession with deer around here.
ReplyDeletePeople are critically injured or killed on Washington Road by motorists (not deer) and the discussion still goes back to deer management.
So we exchange timely leaf pickup for turf? Perhaps by the time the leaves decay in front of my house, they can be used to mop up the water on Cedar... What's up with the leaf pickup?
ReplyDelete9:30 there's not much to understand.
ReplyDeleteThe editor of our community magazine pretty much paints a very realistic picture. People and their circumstances don't matter, its appearances that count in the bubble.
Landscaping matters more than pedestrian safety.
Real estate sales matters more than getting in youth sport games.
And where you shop, speak and look shows whether you belong or not.
It's good to hear the commission isn't budgeting for a deer cull for 2014. Maybe all the speaking up against it made a difference!
ReplyDelete12/10, 2:01pm~
ReplyDeleteSeems to me the YSA and now the SAB have consistently supported improved quality *and* quality of fields.
Contrary to Kelly's blog post, the Robb Hollow field would *not* have been a full-sized field. So the ROI of developing it would have been pretty low, with respect to gains for organized sports.
So Kelly's plan was not "exactly what they [SAB] asked for." It would have left essentially unchanged the burden on existing fields for games, which would do little to improve the state of overuse which you rightly mention as a concern of YSA/SAB.
Just wanted to set that straight.
6:12 PM, you're calling Kelly a liar? She wrote:
ReplyDelete"In 2012, I did propose for two additional fields to be added to our current field use. These fields would have been in Robb Hollow. We have discussed various versions of a Robb Hollow Plan but one of the initial plans was one full size (eco-friendly turf) in the area where the leaf grinding takes place and the other (jr. field) near public works near the corner of Cedar/Gilkeson. Two new field areas."
Elaine
6:12, not exactly.
ReplyDeleteAn additional field, even if not full-sized takes some of the stress off the other fields, allowing them to recover from over use. The younger kids and practices can easily use a smaller field.
Plus Kelly's development of the Robb Hollow space cleans up an entry into our community and adds recreational amenities for a wider spectrum of residents.
Her plan included a dog park, walking/jogging paths, an outdoor classroom etc.
So if the goal is to just turf a full sized field you did set the record straight. But then you ignored everybody and everything else!
So much for 6:12 "setting the record straight."
ReplyDeleteMaybe we can get Franklin and Cannon to demand they sign their name!
6:12 in the interest of serving the "concerns of the YSA/SAB" turfing Wildcat/Middle does very little to alleviate the demand for more fields.
ReplyDeleteJust wanted to set the record straight.
6:12 PM, I sent your comment to Kelly and asked her if it was true. Here is her response:
ReplyDelete"Hi Elaine,
Thank you for the question.
This information is very much untrue. I’m not sure where the information came from.
The upper field would have been full size and the lower (near public works) would have been junior size.
I had heard from someone in the community that has a background in fields that the PW area south of the salt dome (for the Jr. field) could have been close to the size of Bird Park field. However I personally thought that the space was a nice space for our little ones for Soccer and LaCrosse. It would have been nice to get the little ones off of Middle/Wildcat so that field could have had the rest needed and the little kids don’t need regulation size for what they do as pre-k/kindergarten, first grade.
Upper field would have been full size used for soccer, even football, as well as field hockey and LaCrosse.
Oh, in addition the plan called for the upper field to be eco-friendly turf.
Near the end, we were talking about utilizing the pre-existing utilities for the bathrooms where the old house use to be.
Taking the pre-existing slab from a former pavilion and putting a pavilion back which would have been near the field.
Adding an outdoor classroom etc.
We had three options for parking in the upper section and two additional options that were not discussed in public.
I hope this helps."
This sounds so much like December 10, 2013 at 11:21 AM.
Elaine
6:12 now that you have the real story are you still going to support turfing Wildcat/Middle which doesn't fields or lobby for Kelly's plan?
ReplyDeleteWhen this post started I emailed Kelly. Her reply, "This would have been a great project for Mt Lebanon. I was not invited to an SAB meeting to discuss this project as you suggest. I'm not sure what projects (former/new) they reviewed prior to making their final decision. Unfortunately the sports groups didn't understand that Robb Hollow wasn't just about them but a full community-wide project that most residents young and old could see the benefits. The field was one piece of a pie. Does that make sense? I walked many times up in Robb Hollow with many interested residents sharing my idea. The right people didn't see the potential and so it didn't go. That happens. It's ok. Sometimes you win and others times you don't. I just feel in my heart we missed a very big, bright new piece of Mt Lebanon."
ReplyDeleteShe has class.
According to the following article, Kelly's Robb Hollow proposal, with natural grass fields instead of turfed ones would satisfy almost everyone as I read it.
ReplyDeletePlus her proposal offers amenities to groups other than the YSA/SAB.
One would think the Parks advisory board would side with her.
http://cafnr.missouri.edu/research/turfgrass-costs.php
"Don't let anyone come around and say it's for cost reasons," Fresenburg said. "Maybe they can say they'll have more events. That's true. I can't argue with that. No natural field is ever going to stand the same amount of use as a synthetic field."
"Fresenburg said a public agency could take the same money it would cost to install a synthetic field and instead put in a sand-capped field. The remaining money could be placed into a maintenance fund with recurring bond revenue. Then the agency would have a premium natural grass field with most of the maintenance costs covered."
Plus, why wouldn't her multi-function recreation area be as big a selliing point to home buyers as the single purpose turfing at Wildcat/Middle?
One would think realtors would love to show off her Robb Hollow park!
That is the problem, 10:38 AM. One would think the Parks Advisory Board would side with her, but look who is representing the PAB on the Sports Advisory Board. Dave Franklin. David Donnellan is the municipal staff liaison. This was the plan from the very beginning. I am sure that they would both say that they are not voting members of the SAB, but look who started the SAB. Dave Brumfield. And who is the commission liaison to the SAB? John Bendel. Do you think Kelly's plan EVER had a shot? I don't.
ReplyDeleteElaine
I should say that David Donnellan is the municipal staff liaison for both the Parks Advisory Board and the Sports Advisory Board. He wants turf, climbing walls, and all the other bells and whistles for the pool.
ReplyDeleteKelly is the commission liaison to the Parks Advisory Board.
Elaine
Kelly didn't fight hard enough for her plan. I'm a sports person and never heard anything about it. It makes far more sense than turfing M/WC. I thought her plan was about a dog park.
ReplyDelete12:29
ReplyDeleteYour response is EXACTLY why the Dave's and Bendel's didn't communicate her plan through the sports groups.
Because people who have common sense would see that the addition of two new fields, at least one of which likely with turf, makes the most sense for the community. And since we need to develop Robb Hollow anyway in order to swap McNeilly, it should have been a slam dunk.
I don't know why the Dave's and Bendel's are focused so much on Wildcat/Middle. The Jr. field would be practically right down the street and would fix an eyesore of a public works area which is worse than potential home buyers looking at (gasp!) grass fields.
Besides presenting in public meetings this proposal, inviting numerous people to walk Robb Hollow, and posting the plan numerous times on her blog, how should she have fought harder?
I know, Susan could have put an article in the magazine! Honestly, that would have been best but we all know that's not what the magazine does.
Do you really think it would have mattered if you knew about Kelly's entire plan? Brumfield, Linfante, Bendel knew about it. Franklin knew about it. Donnellan knew about it. I have blogged about it. Kelly blogged about it. Everyone in the coffee house on Washington Rd. knew about it where the heated and passionate discussion occurred. I don't want to say yelling, because Franklin denies that there was yelling.
ReplyDeleteKeeping the "sports people" in the dark was by design. Likewise, keeping Bendel's plan and the budget amendments under wraps was no coincidence either.
Elaine
Perhaps, if someone is so inclined, we could get a side by side comparison of the Bendel plan and Fraasch plan?
ReplyDeleteInfo I would like to know:
1. How many practice fields would be created under each plan?
2. What additional practice time could be done under each plan?
3. What is the cost of each plan?
4. What are the unmeasurables (for the Dave's it would be the value of a real estate agent driving by. for Robb Hollow it would be at least the two mentioned above about fixing an eyesore and swapping the unusable mcneilly).
I don't know...what else?
I am not up for the challenge. It is pointless anyway. The commission already voted on turfing Middle and Wildcat. They don't want to know any more.
ReplyDeleteIf you are up to it, be my guest. The links to both plans have been shared here.
Elaine
12:29, why should Kelly have to "fight" for her plan.
ReplyDeleteShe did the initial leg work, the research and the presentation.
Now you think she didn't fight hard enough! Next you'll want her to dig up the sod and lay the turf.
We have a generously compensated PIO and supported "community" magazine that claims: "this claim: "Our goal is to increase the transparency of municipal government, to give you the information you need to have input into the decision-making process..."
See any information from the PIO, the magazine so you could provide input in the decision-making process. Not on your life.
It wasn't what the cabal wanted. Quid pro quo rules in Lebo.