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| What is that slimy thing?? |
Here is what the parent wrote:
Here is an anonymous pic of local indoor turf. The little ones *sit* on it when their coaches talk to them. My child played on this tonight (we didn't know the hazards until the Lebo issue came up). Anyway, my child said he/she got a piece in his/her mouth because the child sitting next to him/her on the field was playing with it. Kids can just grab the infill by the handful.
Looking at the handful of infill, (try to ignore the slimy foreign object) the "blades of grass" do separate from the backing.
The commissioners will have more discussions about turf during Monday's Commission Discussion Session. Starting at 6:15 PM, J.T. Sauer and Associates will review turf infill options with the commissioners. I would be curious to know if J.T. Sauer can identify that slimy foreign object.
Item #2 on the Discussion Session Agenda, Commissioner Bendel will cover the next steps for the field project.
Stick around for the 8:00 Commission meeting, where residents can comment. I will not be at the meeting, due to a work conflict.
A number of years ago I chaperoned an overnight with my daughter's girl scout troop to the Robert Morris ice complex/indoor golf center. We set up our sleeping bags in the bubble that had an artificial turf surface. It looked gross but we had no choice of where to sleep. When we got home we discovered little green pellets in all of our belongings - the sleeping bags, backpacks, clothes. I found little pellets in my house for days afterward.
ReplyDeleteNeedless to say, I don't think this is a healthy surface for kids to play sports on. It is easy to see how a child or teenager could accidently ingest these pellets when they are engaged in rough and tumble sporting activities. I think natural grass is a far superior and healthy playing surface for the children of Mt. Lebanon.
Visit the Capital Projects document available here in a previous topic in Lebocitizens and look at enrollment projections for the school district.
ReplyDeleteWHY do we need more fields and game slots again. At one time weren't there 8,000 students in the school district. Did anyone lack for game time on our fields?
How come our "California Girls" aren't being more like California?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.sunsetbeacon.com/archives/SunsetBeacon/2008Editions/April08/Paulcol.html
Paul Kozakiewicz: New Problems with Fake Turf
The road to Hell is often paved with good intentions.
"Contributing to Global Warming
Why would we contribute to global warming by removing life that removes carbon dioxide from our atmosphere?
According the non-profit group Athena Institute, the replacement of one grass field would require the planting of 1,861 trees, and allowing them to grow for 10 years, to offset the amount of "carbon dioxide sequestration" lost with the grass fields.
David Brown, a public health toxicologist, wrote a column for the Sunday New York Times explaining some of the dangers of creating playing fields out of petroleum products.
He said each square foot of synthetic surface has 10 or so pounds of tire crumbs, which results in about 225 tons of ground-up tires for a field 300 feet long by 150 feet wide. Silver Terrace is at least twice that size.
"(Studies) found that dust from the rubber crumbs contained carcinogens that could be inhaled into the deepest portions of the lung," Brown wrote."
Here is what you are going to hear on Monday night. There is synthetic infill made from rubber crumbs and there is an organic infill made from cork and coconut shells. I believe it was Commissioner Franklin who said that organic infill has not been around long enough to pass the test of time. I think Commissioner Franklin said that the oldest organic infill is only six years old. We will also hear that organic infill freezes, as well as floats. The SAB would not be pleased with organic infill, and the vendors themselves do not speak highly of organic infill turf. I suppose if the fields were covered with a bubble, those problems would be eliminated. But then you are creating an impervious surface to an area prone to flooding. By the way, no commissioner responded to my question about indoor fields. Six days and counting, Folks.
ReplyDeleteElaine
I learned the other day that turf has to be cleaned or treated to prevent "things" from growing in it! Who is going to cover that expense...How healthy are those chemicals for anyone?
ReplyDeleteYes, that is true, 5:29 PM. I believe that will be in the maintenance agreement with the School District. They have a special vacuum cleaner for the high school toxic turf.
ReplyDeleteElaine
Remember the little conversation Linfante wrote about in her commissioners column?
ReplyDelete"“Mom, where does all the trash go?” he asked.
“It gets taken to a landfill,” I explained. “It’s like a huge garbage dump.”
“But where will it go once the landfill is full, like when I’m grown up?” he asked.
“That’s a really good question,” I replied."
http://lebomag.com/12840/commissioners-column-kristen-linfante-2/
That is a good question, maybe this Reason Foundation Report can answer the child's question.
http://www.ncpa.org/pdfs/st165.pdf
"A consumers guide to environmental myths and realities" by Lynn Scarlett [be sure to read Scarlett's bio at the end of the report]
"Myth No. 1: We're running out of landfill space. All of the garbage America produces in the next 1,000 years would fit in a landfill that occupies less than one-tenth of 1 percent of the continental United States."
The other myths are equally interesting. I especially like No. 6 as it pertains to the PAYT discussion.
"Mom, where do all the jocks go?" he asked.
ReplyDelete"They go the high school turf," I explained. "It's like a huge garbage dump."
"But where will they go once the field is filled up, like when I'm grown up (and the school is actually finished)?" he asked.
"Why, they'll go to Wildcat, where there will be gasses burning off while they play and toxic runoff into the water system. Yay!", I replied.
Myth NO. 1: We've run out of playing field space. Funny how 20 years ago when there were more kids in this community we somehow accommodated all their precious little wishes when it came to sports. Suddenly we don't have enough space? The commissioners are what I would call dishonest. Actually, I would call them worse but I hear a lot of Lebo's kids read this blog.
Finally, a confirmation - no enclosed fields.
ReplyDeleteElaine
Regarding why there is a perceived field shortage:
ReplyDeleteKids of previous generations played in their neighborhoods -- plain, old, free, unstructured, and spontaneous outdoor play. They played sports, too, as we know from the trophy case, but probably not as much and beginning at a later age.
Now kids have busy schedules filled with sports practices and events. Even though there are fewer kids in Mt Lebanon, there are probably more (or at least equal) practices and events being scheduled.
A friend of mine is a civil engineer who consults for school districts. He laughed at the one million dollar estimate for turf of any kind. He suspects the final cost will be more like 1.5 to 2 million dollars. Looks like yet another botched estimate by Gateway Engineering. Of course, they will still get paid.
ReplyDeleteNot quite a definitive "no enclosed fields."
ReplyDeleteNot being aware of any plans is different from stating I will not vote for any enclosed fields!
11:40 and that doesn't include related infrastruct improvements that will need to be done.
ReplyDeleteBetter stormwater handling, expanded parking, lights, and bleachers.
There's currently a bill before the Maryland legislature regarding the need for signs posted at synthetic turf fields. Here is what the signs would say:
ReplyDelete“The Department of Health and Mental Hygiene encourages all those using synthetic infill turf fields to observe the following recommendations:
1. Wash hands and exposed body parts aggressively after playing on field.

2. Turn clothes inside out as soon as possible after using the field to avoid tracking dust and infill to other locations.
3. Keep beverages closed and in bags or coolers when not drinking to minimize contamination from field dust and fibers.
4. Be aware of signs of heat-related illness and dehydration. Fields can get excessively hot on warm, sunny days. Take all necessary precautions.”
http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/2014RS/fnotes/bil_0003/hb0763.pdf
Elaine Don't for a MINUTE believe that an indoor field isn't being talked about. You can't put up a structure over grass so Phase 1 is now in process. Some believe a "Bubble" structure like those at the Tennis Courts would be the easiest. Others want a permanent structure. Looks the Mellon is where it will go as the fields at the park are used for Softball and Baseball. Don't believe me.... Ask yourself what was being said about turf several years ago?
ReplyDeleteWow, 12:37 AM! I guess I better add the word, "aggressively" to the title of this post.
ReplyDeleteI was not too far off asking for a warning on all registration forms, was I? Remember the cigarette ad analogy?
Elaine
The Trib has two articles today which tie in with my RTK concerning artificial turf.
ReplyDeleteState financing authority operations shrouded in secrecy
Shhhhhh! Secret!:The Commonwealth Financing Authority
How many of the 1500 emails will be redacted to benign one- or two-line exchanges referring to attached files or scheduling matters, and the names of correspondents."
Elaine
The Trib makes a good point when officials hide behind a black marking pen—
ReplyDelete"A model of open government and transparency Pennsylvania's Commonwealth Financing Authority is not. And given the public-be-damned secrecy under which it steadfastly operates, reasonable people could — and perhaps they should — assume nefarious activity is underfoot."
Unti transparency and open records exist, assume nefarious activity is underfoot.
Elaine @ 10:58 Can you believe anything Mrs. Linfante says.
ReplyDelete2:04 PM, I don't believe much of anything that comes from our elected officials.
ReplyDeleteElaine
Brumfield and Bendel are practicing attorneys. If they violated the Sunshine Law...ok, ha, when we have the proof they violated it...they can both get in serious doo doo with the bar association. Theyre bound by certain ethica rules. Gee it would be a shame for either of them to lose their license to practice.
ReplyDeleteBendel and Brumfield, we all know you read this blog. Do the right thing and come clean. Admit the whole turf issue was rigged. Be men. Dont be shadowy petty crooks.
Kristin has nothing to lose so she doesnt care if she gets caught. So Kristin, you now have a chance to be a hero and a leader. Blow the whistle and admit to what's going on. This is your one chance to unite Lebo. Think of that. You could be the one to clean house. Heck it might lead to a run at higher office. Come on. Do it. Do the right thing.
2:25 PM, I would like to clarify something that you said. John Bendel is in banking. This is from the municipal website:
ReplyDelete"Director of Community Investment for FHLBank Pittsburgh; worked with 300 banks to increase their lending to and investing in housing, community and economic development projects."
As far as having any proof about Brumfield, that is a little more difficult. With all the RTKs I have filed with the municipality, there were NEVER any emails from Brumfield. How is that possible?
Kristen owes Mt. Lebanon an apology. Did you see The Almanac headlines last week? "Lebo board: Commission blindsided us."
The Sports Advisory Board should disband. They are so darn biased with field sports. We have Dave Brumfield to thank for that one. He created the SAB. The head of the SAB represents lacrosse. Look who coaches for lacrosse.
The sixth commissioner, Dave Franklin, will do whatever it takes to get artificial turf all over Mt. Lebanon. He is the Parks Advisory Board representative on the SAB and pulled a Linfante and never shared the Main Park turf plans with his board.
Elaine
2:25 any official in Pennsylvania that takes an oath before assuming office is subject to the state's ethic laws.
ReplyDeleteFinding someone to enforce them is another matter.
Elaine Cappucci is the ESB representative from the school board. Her better half is the Communications Commissioner for Mt. Lebanon Lacrosse. Shouldn't Elaine have said something to the ESB about artificial turf coming to Middle and Wildcat Fields?
ReplyDeleteElaine
As they say—
ReplyDeleteYOU CAN'T TELL THE PLAYERS WITHOUT A SCORECARD!
See Section 1509 - Ethics of the Home Rule Charter.
ReplyDelete4:33 PM, I see that employees are included.
ReplyDelete"Section 1509. Ethics
Municipal officials and employees shall comply with applicable provisions of the Public Official and Employee Ethics Law, Act 9 of 1989, 65 P.S. §401 et. seq"
Here is a list of restricted activities under the PA State Ethics Commission.
Elaine
Here's how to file a complaint online for anyone licensed by the state that engaged in unethical (i.e., conflict of interest) behavior related to this turf:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.doscomplaintform.state.pa.us
Gateway Engineers.... are licensed by the state as engineers.
Cappucci never said anything to the ESB about the artificial turf. Linfante never said anything to the ESB about the artificial turf. Elaine Labalme never said anything to the ESB about the artificial turf. Rob Papke never said anything to the ESB about the artificial turf. All allegedly environmentalists. All want Building C torn down.
ReplyDeleteHEY MT. LEBANON!! DO YOU GET IT NOW?
Elaine
Sorry I yelled. We have been lied to for years. And it doesn't stop. These people are not children's advocates. It isn't about kids' health and safety. It isn't about 21st century education. It is about gyms, 8 lane swimming pools, and toxic turf.
ReplyDeleteElaine
It's all about money, politics, and power! The snobs want to be in control for they're own self interests!!!!
ReplyDeleteAnd this whole time i thought the school district was the real draw. If I'd known the actual attraction to this town was turf, I would have advocated turfing Washington Road.
ReplyDeleteSilly you, 12:48 AM. Didn't you realize that the school district was the real draw only because of the artificial turf at the stadium? But that is a hidden gem. We need to have artificial turf down on Cedar, so that people can see it during their search for a new home. Only then will people be able to appreciate the crown jewel.
ReplyDeleteI don't know why the ESB hasn't taken issue with the artificial turf at the high school. It is half way through its life and will need to be replaced in four years. The turf before it was replaced prematurely, so the high school turf could possibly go quicker than that.
Toxic turf is not new to our kids. They have been playing on it for years at the high school. Where is the ESB? How can the school board liaison sit back and watch Kristen take the heat for not spilling the beans about Middle and Wildcat? We have been subjecting our kids to the toxins to a whole generation of kids. We were concerned about knee injuries last year, but with the new EPA warnings, why isn't anyone looking at the school district?
Elaine
With all the evidence come out on the hazards of artificial turf, rather than thinking about replacement we should start saving for the day when we'll have to get rid of it— like asbestos.
ReplyDeleteOf course our forward thinking administrators and school board won't do that since providing water feeds to boilers, cafateria tables, classroom desks, auditorium sound system and curtains were beyond their powers of comprehension and therefore needed to be done as capital projects or change orders.
Oh yeah, fear of a referendum causing a re-examination of the project never crossed their minds— BULLSHIT!
What type of turf is used at the high school? When was it last replaced?
ReplyDeleteWith indoor artificial turf one has to wonder how sanitary or hygenic it is.
ReplyDeleteWith no rain to wash away, spit, blood, sweat, etc., how clean can it really be?
Sure they can spray disinfectants, but how many times does a facility really do that? Time is money and an indoor field wetted down with solutions probably takes a long time to dry.
Plus you can't vacuum the turf, doing so would suck up all the rubber, cork or coconut granules. So the best or worst they can do is spread the crap around.
At least on outdoor turf rain at least can wash away some of the junk.
One might say... indoor artificial turf is 'snot' a good idea!
ReplyDelete9:18 AM, the high school turf was replaced in July 2010. It has a rubber crumb infill. MTLSD did void the warranty by setting up all those folding chairs for commencement ceremonies every year.
ReplyDeleteHere is a link from the AstroTurf website which states that as of 2010, our kids have played on artificial turf for 37 years. 37 years on artificial turf The rubber crumb infill made its Lebo debut in 2010.
Elaine
The truth and nothing, but the truth so help me...
ReplyDelete"The Trib quoted Kristen in their article.Mt. Lebanon turf task force inches toward goal"
"Commission President Kristen Linfante said the decision ultimately rests with commissioners. 'At least three of us voted for it because we saw no other options, nowhere else to put fields.'"
According Gateway there is something like 13 options, Ms. Linfante.
http://www.mtlebanon.org/DocumentCenter/Home/View/2660
One of which you commissioners approved- the Brafferton updates- and are now taking back.
Brafferton if memory serves didn't meet with a lot of opposition, so why was it cancelled? Too much money! The Sports groups $250k contributions would cover it with no burden on the taxpayers.
How about the other Gateway options- oh yeah that's right, Brumfield said we don't need to ask our constituents what they think.
No options, Ms. Linfante... really?
Notice how in that Gateway presentation they claim that the Robb Hollow plan cleans up the appearance along Cedar Blvd.
ReplyDeleteGuess realtors will still have to avoid that area with clients.
11:49 makes a great point.
ReplyDeleteWithout the Robb Hollow Park plan, realtors better be real careful about where they turn the car around. Just a few hundred yards from the end of the new turf will be the eyesore that is Mt. Lebanon Public Dump...er Public Works.
So much for a crown jewel along Cedar. Hit the Public Works area and you have the town's Crown Dump.
If any readers other than the six commissioners (5 + Franklin) go to the commission meetings tonight, please send me an email and tell me what happened. If not, I will have to wait until the videos are up tomorrow afternoon. EGillen476@aol.com
ReplyDeleteElaine
Word on the street is Kelley Fraasch will be blindsided again tonight by Linfante, Bendel, Brumfield and staff.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.ncsl.org/research/ethics/50-state-chart-criminal-penalties-for-public-corr.aspx#PA
ReplyDeleteRead the penalties for PA.
Anonymous
Thanks, 3:56. Here is a clickable link for the crime and the time. PENALTIES FOR VIOLATIONS OF STATE ETHICS AND PUBLIC CORRUPTION LAWS
ReplyDeleteElaine
Under the lebocitizens blog topic - "Oh snap SAB! UPDATED"
ReplyDeleteon Feb. 21 at 9:21 pm this link was submitted http://triblive.com/neighborhoods/yoursewickley/yoursewickleymore/5506919-74/field-turf-board#axzz2u0tL05De
"Quaker Valley scores $439K deal for new field turf"
You need to read this article very carefully to catch this little gem.
"Superintendent Joseph Clapper said had board members considered a natural surface, maintenance costs could have been high.
“It costs money to put in a new turf field, but it costs money to maintain a (grass) field,” he said. A decade ago, when school leaders considered replacing a then-grass surface, Clapper said maintenance costs were estimated to be about $30,000 per year, which included labor costs, fertilizer, seeding and preparing the field for winter."
This Superintendent Clapper must be a product of TERC math.
Initial installation of artificial turf, lets say $436,000(the article doesn't say what the costs was in 2004).
Ten year later replacement costs: $436,000 (lets assume another 10 year lifespan).
Total est. costs over twenty years for artificial turf: $872,000. (excluding any turf maintenance from year-to-year)
Clapper's all in estimate for natural grass: $30,000/year.
Total costs over those same twenty years: $600,000!
A difference of in favor of natural grass of -ta da- $272,000.
Yeah, Super. Clapper... turf is the bargain of a lifetime.
And we let these people run our schools!
What a sick group, right 3:42 PM? Let me know what happens.
ReplyDeleteElaine
Elaine - its the same group who went after her husband on SB.
ReplyDeleteI am well aware, 4:39 PM.
ReplyDeleteElaine
Oh wait, don't tell us the "What the Kluckers" and the "Voice of Mt. Lebanon" are coming out of their holes.
ReplyDeleteOh, this ought to be good!
While they are in attendance, someone be sure to ask them where the one latte a month - under $100million high school is!
Come out of their holes? Uh, no. They are on the commission.
ReplyDeleteElaine
Good point!
ReplyDeleteWill the "blindsiding" continue to be about turf?
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of institutional corruption, we can't lean on the EPA to help us with this turf matter. The EPA is currently the subject of an investigation in the Harvard School of Ethics due to their reluctance to release a substantial report on the impact of chemicals on child development.
You'd think with all of the BS going on lately in Mt Lebanon, we'd be able to have a pretty nice grass surface and not have to pay for the fertilizer. Maybe our 5 commissioners plus the 1 un-elected commissioner could help pay down those bonds by selling the BS to townships that want a nice looking field to play on.
ReplyDeleteAnd by the way, the high school turf doesn't look like it's in good shape. Besides garbage that litters the area (empty water bottles, discarded clothing, McDonald's bags, etc), the rubber fill is showing through all over the field. I'd be surprised if they get 2 more years out of it.
Ding, ding, ding! We have a winner! Tonight, at 7:42 PM, someone found out about the Rock Pile under the Capital Projects post. Yes, in two years the school district will be putting in artificial turf on the high school practice field a.k.a. The Rock Pile in 2016. This will be a million dollar project every eight years.
ReplyDeleteElaine
You can be sure that Mrs. Cappucci forgot to tell the ESB about artificial turf going in at the high school. She has two strikes against her. With her husband being with lacrosse, she is letting Kristen be the fall guy (oops - fall girl - sorry Kristen) for not telling the ESB about artificial turf going in at Middle and Wildcat Fields. And now, artificial turf at the high school practice field. Stay tuned. More fun stuff to come.
ReplyDeleteElaine
Sorry, I can't post that comment, 9:44 PM.
ReplyDeleteElaine
So... you are saying that someone announced at 7:42 pm that we are getting two McFields in McLebanon?
ReplyDelete