Email me if you need a sign. Now it all makes sense as to why some signs were stolen over the weekend. It's not over yet, Folks!
Monday, July 28, 2014
It's not over yet
Big news from tonight's commission meeting. The turf contract has not been signed yet. For those of you who have thrown away your anti-turf signs thinking it was a done deal, we can get more signs to you.
Email me if you need a sign. Now it all makes sense as to why some signs were stolen over the weekend. It's not over yet, Folks!
Email me if you need a sign. Now it all makes sense as to why some signs were stolen over the weekend. It's not over yet, Folks!
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62 comments:
Great news!
The turf contract wasn't signed and the world didn't come to an end.
Thousands of teary youth didn't cram the streets, packing on the pounds from the local ice cream and pizza establishments.
The thing is tomorrow the sun and warm weather will return, the fields will dry and sports practice and games will resume.
Mt. Lebanon sports teams will continue to be competitive and successful as they always have been and hopefully if the contract is never signed the municipality will be over $800,000 richer.
A really wise Mr. Franklin once wrote:
"A penny saved, is a penny earned!"
Hope the spendthrift commissioners keep that in mind.
Elaine I heard that a local TV channel is doing research for a news piece on the turf project. Crooked politicians fear the light of this. Add Cool Springs and the money from ripping off each and EVERY youth athlete that signs up for a sport dries up. We spent a couple of hours last weekend at Cool Springs hitting a couple buckets of balls and eating at their new digs. It was nice! The manager explained what was yet to come. Mt Lebanon has a lot to worry about. Professional coaches. Olympic training. Sports Medicine. And well maintained fields. The best athletes will play there. Wonder if the best athletes will skip the High School teams?
It's about time, 6:07 AM! Crooked politicians? Isn't that 80% of the commission and school board and about 90% of the sports advisory board?
Gateway really screwed up again last night. This time, over moving the leaf grinding operation to McNeilly. They screwed up the turf project by donating to a self-serving project (YAY!), were waaay off with Brafferton, and the 1st pool bid opening resulted in a lawsuit.
A resident lambasted Steve Silverman and John Bendel last night over the lack of due diligence with the Field Maintenance Agreement. Linfante and Brumfield were not present. John Bendel confirmed that Public Works and the Recreation Director will be monitoring the District's performance. The Municipality will be responsible for the warranty. No mention of who is cleaning the fields. Eww.
Elaine
The turf agreement was just the icing on the massive cake of ridiculousness.
If my memory serves me correctly the agreement states simply that the school district will "regularly" maintain the turf complex.
It doesn't say WHAT they will do, it doesn't say WHEN they will do it and it doesn't say how OFTEN the what and when will happen.
The school district could legitimately "maintain" the field twice a year and be compliant with the contract. No mention of what happens when deer poop needs to be cleaned up. Who takes care of that? How is it taken care of? What about when a kid pukes from being overheated? Who applies the disinfectant?
Maybe Franklin and his dwarven buddy Chip should clean the fields. They wanted 'em--they should help maintain 'em.
6:07 If they are the best athletes, then high school sports have very little to do with their success.
6:07 it wouldn't surprise me if the local TV station does a fluff investigation making turf look good.
Uh, I don't think so, 1:41 PM.
Elaine
If it comes to a teacher layoff or cleaning the field which one do you think the board will do? Fields will finish last!
One would think the YSA/School District/Muni field msintenance agreement would have been a lesson on crafting a maintenance agreement on who does what, when and for how much.
Under that expired agreement our fields went to hell. Now they're going to make it happen once again because to put in the duties into writing someone becomes responsible for seeing them through.
By not spelling it all out no one takes ownership.
3:42, there is a third option!
They raise school district taxes. That'll happen before teacher layoffs or cuts in field maintenance, but just after the bonuses and raises are handed out.
How do you give administrators a 2.9% pay increase (2.1% base + 0.8% merit pay) on a 2.1% Act 1 millage limit?
I think you are right 4:32 PM.
response to 4:32....
Perhaps MtLebo Board Members use the 'new math' taught in place of standard rational mathematics. Could be a fuzzy math with 'greater than' and 'less than' interchangeable to fit the outcome.
I meant to reply to 5:29
Several High School coaches have openly talked about Cool Springs and how the best athletes will ditch High School teams in order to train with the best coaches and equipment. It's all about getting noticed by college recruiters and a program like what is being setup by Cool Springs will do so. Elaine do you think the "Little man" will be asked to coach there? Or is he such a joke that only Lebo Ball will accept him?
I'd rather pay my municipal sports fee and drive my kids to Cedar blvd than sign up for professional coaches, Olympic training and sports Medicine at Cool Springs. And what exactly is Olympic training? It's marketing. let me get this straight - you think parents are getting fleeced because their money went to turf, but think it's reasonable for parents to pay exorbitant fees for the above mentioned services. Also, has anyone asked if Cool Springs plans to install field turf at any point? My money is on yes. I've instructed my kids to stay away from the mini golf. I haven't seen any studies from Cool Springs on what type of prodcut their using and the dangers to children.
9:55 AM, yesterday was the Lebo tax bills deadline. I was livid when I wrote my two checks. Over $800,000 of our tax dollars are going into turfing two fields, just so that your kids can play in the rain.
Quite frankly, I don't care what "prodcut" they are using because parents will have a choice whether to allow their kids to play on those fields. My tax dollars didn't contribute to Cool Springs. What a good parent you are for instructing your kids to stay away from the mini golf. Will the turfed fields at Middle and Wildcat be off limits to your children, as well?
Elaine
9:55 AM - I don't begrudge your kids their sports. But I would like you to explain to me why you feel that every taxpayer in Mt. Lebanon has to pay so that your children can play some sort of field sport on artificial grass? How does that help me, my wife, and my kids - who don't play field sports?
9:55 by all means, if you prefer to drive your kids to Cedar Blvd. do so, but expect the rest of us to buy artificial turf for them to play on.
The people that chose Cool Springs will decide if that is their cup of tea.
That way everybody is happy. By forcing artificial turf on the community somebody gets stuck with a bill that neither asked for or want.
How do you figure that is fair?
Correction: Today is the deadline for the discount on our Lebo tax bills, not yesterday. I am sleep deprived and don't know what day it is.
Elaine
Correction @4:13
"9:55 by all means, if you prefer to drive your kids to Cedar Blvd. do so, but [don't] expect the rest of us to buy artificial turf for them to play on."
9:55, no one is going to put a lien on any family's home if the don't "pay exorbitant fees" for their kids to play at Cool Springs!
I wish 9:55am would address the comments that have come in since his post; especially the question asked by 3:21pm. The sports people don't mind proclaiming the (dubious) benefit of artificial turf with respect to property values because that argument has the sound of "community good." But when they are asked to justify forcing disinterested residents to pay for something they will never use, for a benefit they will never receive, the "crickets chirp." So, 9:55am, please answer 3:21pm's question.
As long as we have Steve Feller, Susan Morgans, the four commissioners, and the SAB, we will have the corruption. I could have stacks and stacks of RTKS on my dining room table for as long as we will have toxic turf in Mt. Lebanon, and nothing is going to change.
Until "someone" starts reporting the corruption to the proper agencies, the media starts to expose Mt. Lebanon for what we really are, or an injunction is filed, it will continue.
Something has to give. I am going to have a stroke. The migraines are getting worse. I can't keep this up.
Elaine
Elaine, so sorry I misspelled product. And of course you don't care if Cool Springs installs Field Turf. It's only a safety concern when it increases your tax bill. Or you only care about the health of kids who live in Mt. Lebanon.
In response to the 'is it fair question'...When you live in a community like Mt. Lebanon (or any other suburb) not every penny of every tax dollar will directly benefit you and/or your family. We are lucky to have clay tennis courts, 4 platform tennis courts, an ice rink, swimming pool,etc. They are all part of what make Mt. Lebanon a great place to live and raise a family. Just because it's not for you doesn't mean it's not an asset to the community. While I don't think field turf will increase property value, it will certainly be a draw to young families. And it will solve a problem. Maybe not for you, or you family, but for the thousands of kids and their parents who sign up for sports. And Elaine please stop saying "so they can play in the rain." I really hope at this point you realize that fields are often closed for days after it rains.
10:13 PM, all the amenities you listed are open to the public. Middle and Wildcat are not.
Didn't your signs say something like,"Let our kids play even when it rains. Proven safe!" Or didn't you mean that?
Elaine
Yeah, Andy McNitt and Susan Morgan proved them safe.
10:13 what drew you here ? The field turf isn't in yet.
We moved here for the schools.
10:13 PM, I care about all kids' health, even yours. It is unfortunate that Susan Morgans didn't allow anyone "to discuss the potential harmful effects of artificial turf..."
But what do I know? I don't post "thoughtful, civil comments." I print what I see in RTKs.
Elaine
To 10:13:: You are intimating that any people opposed to the turf are whining. You don't get it! The issues are about certain elected SB administrators, municipal employees, Commissioners, Sports advocates, and the Mt.Lebanon Endowment Committee, who are in collusion to violate PA laws regarding State Code of Ethics, IRS Regulations, PA Code for State DEP of Education, and Auditor General regulations that are being violated! Massive corruption! Stop picking on Elaine!!!
Elaine has done a tremendous job exposing the back door deals, lies, and financial fraud in the community!!! Give her a break!
Elaine, they weren't my signs. And yes the amenities I listed are open to public. But they are also pay to play. There will be plenty of opportunities for you to enjoy the new field turf. I'm sure if you go down there any school day before 3pm you could play frisbee, kick a soccer ball or put together a pick up softball game.
10:47 - I moved here for the High School Field turf. Kidding....
For a variety of reason. Location being #1; then schools, neighborhoods, uptown area...
Now that I have kids I appreciate the need for things like field space.
And I should say despite my support for the field turf and my sarcastic tone, I do agree that the township and commissioners botched this whole thing from the beginning. And I agree that much of what you post here is right on. They are dishonest and not accountable to anyone but their "friends". Despite that I'm still allowed to think field turf is a good idea.
11:34 you are right. I disagree on the turf issue and think many of these comments are frivolous and irrelevant. But Elaine is working very hard to expose those who have colluded to present this in a disingenuous manner.
I see Dave B has been here... Afraid of Cool Springs Dave? Afraid that they might just have coaches that are REAL coaches not wanna-be 3rd string athletes? Afraid your kid couldn't cut it there? And to answer your question on whether or not Cool Springs will have "Field Turf"... They are saying No. The deal with the Sports Medicine folks says No Way. It's to be all Natural Grass. If you can't figure out what a word means then do what my kid says "GOOGLE IT!". A lawyer should be able to understand that concept. Even a 12-year JR Lawyer.
Several flaws or facts in your argument, 10:13.
While you may consider artificial turf a valuable amenity of asset that doesn't mean everyone sees it that way.
As for not being against artificial turf at Cool Springs there are a number of differences in the comparison.
1. Parents can decide to let their kids play there or not. Turfing WC/M takes away the choice if they want to join Lebo field sports.
2. With an indoor facility there aren't many options for a playing surface. You can't grow grass indoors, economically so unlike WC/M there isn't a choice between grass or turf.
Besides many of the issues with field turf are mitigated in an indoor application.
The rubber pellets don't wash away into our streams and waterways.
The rubber doesn't break down as readily since it isn't exposed to the sun.
Indoors you don't have the heat island effect you get outdoors that can have an impact on players. Even some papers from PSU McNitt's turf studies talk about heat related injuries from turf.
So, 10:13 if you're going to play the comparison game make sure you include all the pertinent facts and issues.
Another point you don't mention is the care and maintenance of every other field in the municipality. Or do you plan on turfing them all?
10:13, keeping taxes reasonable will draw young families to Mt. Lebanon as well and it doesn't cost over a million dollars to do.
How about lobbying for that!
The fact that the annual median wage groups in the $70,000 dollar range are shrinking and being replace with groups in the $45,000-$50,000 range completely escapes you, doesn't it.
If that trend continues all of Lebo's amenities from recreation to schools to police and fire protection will suffer the consequences.
So build your keep building your "crown jewels."
And now the #1 question, 10:13.
IF ARTIFICIAL TURF IS SUCH A GREAT DEAL FOR THE COMMUNITY... WHY THE SUBTERFUGE TO GET IT PAST RESIDENTS?
12:02.
My comment at 12:07 is based on the assumption that an artificial surface like FieldTurf is mandated in an indoor facility.
I would think Cool Springs would need to book an indoor field nearly round the clock to make a profit.
Perhaps we should ask them what kind of natural grass they're using that will stand up to heavy use and survive indoors before we dump over a million dollars in fake grass.
11:54, so what you are saying is...
"the end justifies the means!"
Great lesson for our youth and a helluva way to 'run a railroad!'
About what 11:54 PM said, Middle and Wildcat Fields will be Pay as You Play. Will I need to pay $15 for a game of Frisbee, that is, if I only use one field? If I need both fields, will I need to pay $30? And just how are these fees being accounted? Will there be a big parking meter there? Will there be a User Fee Agreement with all the sports associations? Somewhere in the huge stack of RTKs, I read that there will be an adjustment in user fees based on their initial donation. That defeats the purpose of the user fee. The fees are being charged to pay toward the yearly maintenance plus replacement and disposal costs every eight years. Also the replacement costs were calculated using 108,000 sq. ft., also in the RTK. The numbers don't add up, no matter how bad my math is.
Elaine
It's good math if you use TERC math, Elaine.
Plus, gee we really need a million dollar surface for you or any other resident to have a place "to go before 3pm on any school day and play frisbee, kick a soccer ball or have a pick up softball game."
I think we just got to the meat of the matter. This turf is for the high school lacrosse and soccer teams.
The district gets their regulation soccer/lacrosse field without paying for it.
Thanks 11:54 for shining the light!
Elaine, find that RTK again because if fees are based on users groups "donation" then I suspect the IRS will not consider it a charitable contribution. If true it's a prepaid fee in reality.
1. Which high school team practiced at the Rock Pile regularly before construction eviscerated its use?
2. Without the Rock Pile and Middle/Wildcat this fall, where are the teams practicing?
So this is how it works in the bubble?
One's ability to make "charitable donations" gets one preferential treatment!
I wonder if this thinking applies at the school district level? Perhaps Mr. Ewing can tells us.
If you're a big donor to the SD Capital Campaign does that get you the best teachers, a spot on the varsity team in your kids chosen sport, preferential treatment?
Basing fees, schedules or anything else in the municipality on ones "donation" is a scary precident.
8:00 AM, I haven't found the specific email yet, but I have updated the latest post, "You can't handle the truth" with Gateway's underestimated replacement cost and the TPTF "spin looms large here."
Elaine
The TPTS presentation hints at the charitable contributions when it says "We are working to develop an incentive plan for donors who act quickly and contribute." This is going to take hours, 8:00 AM. It may not be today.
Elaine
I hope I'm not being sent on a wild goose chase and this is just busy work. I do have other things I would rather be doing. Is it getting to the point that I am doing this for no particular reason or will this be used as evidence?
Elaine
Sorry to burden you with more work, Elaine.
To any thinking person, it is pretty obvious now what is going on. The high school soccer and lacrosse teams have been lobbying for 'regulation' sized playing spaces for years.
They couldn't get them through the district because of space limitations and the budget busting high school.
So now through the generosity of some municipal leaders and officials they're getting what they wanted all along and the district only has to shell out a few thousand every year in surperficial maintenance.
Elaine, don't do it then, because being neither an account or a tax lawyer, I can't guarantee it will lead anywhere.
My thinking is that if a donation leads to preferential treatment or fee structureit is no longer a "Charitable" contribution.
If your TV turf investigation is on the ball they'll have their paid attorneys look at it.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that football won't share. They feel they arrived first at the stadium and thus, they get Friday night, practice time, and a marching band, of which students are required to participate at the high school level if they play an eligible instrument and are enrolled in a credit-producing music class.
Football = greed, dominance, outdated superiority
The Gateway estimate on turf replacement is very interesting and something opponents of turf have been speculating and warning about all along.
Gateway low balls replacement in 8 years at $600,000+. Almost the amount of undesignated tax revenue to install turf in the first place.
The replacement emails bewteen the Turf advisors don't show them picking up the replacement tab completely through donations.
If the Steelers can resod their natural grass field every year for around $20,000/year (according to ESPN) our engineer has design us into a big money pit!
Sorry correction - $28,000 to resod.
"It costs between $800,000 and $1.2 million to install FieldTurf. It costs $28,000 each time a field is re-sodded. Of course, there is more maintenance and upkeep on grass. And, naturally, there is more wear and tear on a grass field."
Here's a link to the ESPN article:
http://a.espncdn.com/nfl/columns/clayton_john/1461243.html
Here's a crazy idea.
Why don't we turn McNeilly and Robb Hollow into turf farms and grow our own replacement sod for all the fields. McNeilly would still be recreation oriented so meets its original grant use requirement.
It's good for the environment and the SAB/TAB doesn't have to find ways to come up with annual $32,000 replacement charitable contributions.
Really? Take some time and travel outside of MTL and notice what is going on in other communities. Not so long ago MTL was a model community with state of the art facilities.
For example:
First HS turf filed
For years only ice rink in S Hills
Best Tennis facility in S Hills
Improvements are needed in many areas and fields to serve our residents is a great place to start. Maintaing natural grass fields is not possible! Did you ever look at Heinz Field?
Turf is coming and here to stay. It is safe, convenient, and adds value to the community.
11:19 -Safe according to who? the turf salesman?
The one actual toxicologist who came before the commission said otherwise on 6/24.
Truly 'model communities with state of the art facilities' are finding sustainable and natural ways to meet the needs of their residents.
Artificial turf is a 1970s solution to todays problem.
I was at Heinz Field on Sunday and it was gorgeous. In fact, the international soccer tournament is requiring grass fields. Guinness, the sponsor, is having grass sod put on top of turf fields in Mn and Michigan, to mention a few, for the soccer players because soccer is terrible for players on turf.
Elaine, feel free to post the picture I sent you of Heinz from Sunday but only of time permits.
According to the Almanac SF is planning international trips to France and Spain in every other year at no cost to the district. The $4,000 cost will be from fundraising. Perhaps the municipality needs to charge more than $12 per year to use (replace) the turf field.
11:19, one might suggest it is you that needs to get outside of your little myopic world. This isn't Allegheny County 1970 anymore.
Why don't you take a little drive north to the region's fastest growing community. Stop at the Dick's Sportsplex at Graham Park. Natural grass fields are the order of the day. I'm pretty sure no one there is gping to envy your pathetic "crown jewel."
Want to read what Cranberry's latest trendy recreational improvement is. Read the following—
"Cranberry debuts fitness centers that encourage health and socializing
May 29, 2014 7:41 AM
By Karen Kane / Pittsburgh Post-Gazette"
"Four outdoor fitness centers — the first of a kind for the region — will open June 4. They are gifts of the Cranberry Township Community Chest, a nonprofit group that raises funds for community improvement. The project costs about $200,000, according to Cranberry Parks and Recreation Director Pete Geis."
http://www.post-gazette.com/local/north/2014/05/29/Cranberry-debuts-outdoor-fitness-centers-that-encourage-health-and-socializing/stories/201405290046
With 70% of Lebo's population 25 or older why are we spending $1,000,000+ plus on the 10% (and shrinking) demographic?
But you keep living in your little fantasy land, it's OK, we understand.
11:19am - Does it matter to you who owns all of the facilities that seem to so enrapture you? In other words, do you care who owns the ice rink, the swimming pool, the tennis courts, or the fields of fake grass? If you originally moved here for those things, would it have made a difference to you whether they were owned privately or by the municipality?; and would that have influenced your decision to move into Mt. Lebanon? If you're a native, do you see the community as giving to the local government according to each person's ability so that it might be distributed to each person, according to that person's need? Does that sound good to you?
Regarding those contributions that will result in reduced users fees. From the IRS—
http://www.irs.gov/uac/Eight-Tips-for-Deducting-Charitable-Contributions
"7. To claim a deduction for contributions of cash or property equaling $250 or more you must have a bank record, payroll deduction records or a written acknowledgment from the qualified organization showing the amount of the cash and a description of any property contributed, and whether the organization provided any goods or services in exchange for the gift. One document may satisfy both the written communication requirement for monetary gifts and the written acknowledgement requirement for all contributions of $250 or more. If your total deduction for all noncash contributions for the year is over $500, you must complete and attach IRS Form 8283, Noncash Charitable Contributions, to your return."
Now why would the IRS specifically ask for infomation on whether there was an exchange of gifts or services?
Did the commissioners deliberately skirt rules regarding donations by running it through the community endowment to hide the quid pro quo of reductions in user fees? Opinions... lawyers, accountants and judges out there, please?
Plus, if sports groups get lower or preferential field usage fees because they donated some amount of money to turf, then some part of their donation isn't really a donation. It is a prepayment and shouldn't count towards the $250,000 private money!
Example:
Let's look at Youth Football's donation of $6,666.66. (an odd amount by the way! Is this what they pay in field user fees regularly?)
According to Elaine's RTK search - donating groups are to receive reductions in their users fees. (Universally applied to all MTL fields or just WC/M????)
So let's say football without a donation would be billed $4,000 to use the field. (I don't know what their usage fees are)
But, because they did donate, they get a reduced rate of $2,000.
Then football in reality only donated $4,666.66 towards turf. Two thousand dollars was an advance on future user fees!
6:29--i wonder how many readers immediately grasp your reference. Sadly, though, that specific idelologue has obviously influenced most our elected officials on one side of the aisle for the last few years.
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