Yesterday was the targeted date for construction to begin on the "Field Enhancement Project" a.k.a. turfing Middle and Wildcat Fields.
It was reported on Facebook that people are marooned at the Rec Center due to Cedar Blvd. flooding.
It was reported on Facebook that people are marooned at the Rec Center due to Cedar Blvd. flooding.
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| Photo courtesy Brooks Bratten @brooksbratten |
Little rain this morning in the bubble. https://t.co/GJdKyfoB1l
— Brooks Bratten (@brooksbratten) August 3, 2014
Stormy Sunday causes flooding, other damage throughout viewing area
Update August 6, 2014 4:01 PM Through a Right To Know, read what Tim White says about water run-off. He wants something to appease the ESB people and diffuse Kelly F.
Keep in mind, Gateway Engineers lists right on the bid documents that "No Wetlands Exist on Site" and "Site is not in the 100 year floodplain." Maybe this is part of the problem of flooding on Cedar.
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89 comments:
Did you receive permission to reprint someone's personal comments from their FB page? Also, you should add a disclaimer stating this photo is not from today. It is clearly and old photograph since the fields have banners up and one of the trees in the photo has since been removed. Spin much?
How much more flooding will be caused by the turf project? It makes you wonder if the water level will reach the rec center.
Oh, yes, our illustrious Commissioners looking out for us!
What a joke.
Another one of those 100 year rain events that PW can't prepare for.
But we do have $800,000 in municipal undesignated tax money for turf. That is a priority!
Isn't Morgan Drive the only way out of the park currently? Are the entrances at the top blocked because of the high school construction?
Elaine
Someone could make a fortune by providing ferry service from Morgan to Greenhurst. Or maybe the municipality could charge $15 to kayak or canoe down Cedar. Si?
Must be all those uncashed stormwater fee checks clogging the system!
Isn't going to be thrilling to watch what happens after those quick draining fields and tons of crumb rubber granules wash into the storm system.
If the pro-turfers were smart, they'd rush someone down to Cedar with a camera and one of their "Let Our Kids Play-Even When It Rains" signs.
A perfect photo- op!
I'm telling you we should've have turned this area into a community lake. We can't have the rowing teams going outside the bubble to participate in that growing Olympic sport.
Morgan Dr is the only exit from the rec center. So kids and families that arrived by car were stuck inside the center due to the flooding.
I thought the stormwater system was adequate to handle rain water? So the plan is to take away grass and dirt on the fields and replace it with what, a base of clay and rock covered by plastic and rubber crumbs?? Good plan, Dave and Dave. Good plan. I'll think about that as I keep driving over the same shi--y roads in Lebo that havent been fixed, looking at the eyesore that is our "business corridor", paying my taxes, reading "our" community magazine and being told if I don't like it, I should move. You fools. The high school is enough of a joke and caused a great deal of animosity. Well, the next time someone is told to wait for or cost-share new sidewalks or bring up a dog park only to be mocked, they can point the finger at you two. I will.
I'm getting reports of people's homes flooded in Lebo. Again. Some with only stormwater, while others with sewage too.
How long have I been pleading for unassigned funds to help families with flooding issues? Thank you, Dave Brumfield, John Bendel, Kristen Linfante, Steve Silverman, David Donnellan, Steve Feller, Gateway Engineering, the Public Information Office, and the Sports Advisory Board for being the selfish B's that you are. Get your priorities straight.
Elaine
I can only bet our wonderful commissioners have no idea about the flooding that has taken place today. Maybe one has gone out to help but the others---doubt it.
I can pretty much guarantee that Kelly Fraasch has gone out to help. She has after every other flood that we have had during her term.
Elaine
Where's that Stormwater taaaax, er ahhhh... fee going.
Seems like stormwater flooding problems are occurring more since the tax... er fee (sorry) was instituted.
Contact this FEMA rep and ask him why this intersection is not included as a designated flash flood hazard in Mt Lebanon. Mt Lebo has until Sept 26 to get their act together on flood plain management.
Luis Rodriguez, Chief, Engineering Management Branch, Federal Insurance and Mitigation Administration, FEMA, 500 C Street SW., Washington, DC 20472, (202) 646-4064, or (email) Luis.Rodriguez3@fema.dhs.gov;
For those residents affected by stormwater flooding and those paying the stormwater fee.
Great article from Oct. 7,2011 in the Trib.
http://triblive.com/mobile/1106403-96/fee-lebanon-nonprofits-catholic-road-bernard-municipality-parish-taxation-based
"Mt. Lebanon instituted the fee this summer to raise money to repair, upgrade and expand its 75-mile storm sewer system. It sent the first quarterly bills in September. Apartment buildings, commercial properties and nonprofits are charged $8 per month for every 2,400 square feet of "impermeable surface," such as roofs, patios, parking lots and sidewalks; single-family homes, town houses and duplexes are charged a flat $8 per month.
Mt. Lebanon Commissioner David Brumfield, a supporter of the fee, said it meets legal definitions of a service-based fee instead of a tax, since it is specific to improving stormwater management. He said the municipality chose a service-based fee so it could be applied to large parcels of runoff-prone land held by nonprofits such as schools, churches and St. Clair Hospital."
Hope you don't get too offended Commissioner Brumfield when I write-- YOUR STORMWATER MANAGEMENT SUCKS!
But keep on focusing on turf, big guy.
A message to all flood victims:
The contract for the artificial turf has not been signed yet. It is not a done deal, as some would like you to think. After you are done cleaning up your mess, or even on a break from cleaning up your basements, yards, etc., send the entire commission an email and let them know how you feel.
commission@mtlebanon.org
Elaine
So what improvements were made? Im still missing something.
I'm going to finally approve a comment that was submitted this morning. I was accused of putting up an old photo. The comment is time stamped at 11:24 AM.
Elaine
I faked lightning striking St. Bernard Church too.
Storms prompt flood warnings in Pittsburgh, surrounding counties
I'm THAT good.
Elaine
11:24 they may or may not be old photos, I don't know.
This appeared in the photo captions from The Tribs coverage of today's storms.
"Mt Lebanon police officers direct traffic at the intersection of Salem Road and Cedar Boulevard in Mt. Lebanon where flooding occurred around 9:30 a.m. until 10:30 a.m on Sunday, Aug. 3, 2014. with approximately four feet of water, according to Mt. lebanon police. Water levels lowered and only man holes were pushing out water around 10:30 a.m. Sunday morning. — Emily Harger | TRIB TOTAL MEDIA"
Interesting day at the rec center - the pool was evacuated due to the storm and everyone was made to wait in the rec center. The police wouldn't let people leave because the only way out to the pool/park parking lot was via flooded cedar. Commissioner Brumfield was one of the many stranded in the rec center for the better part of an hour and a half... I wonder if he has a different view of the flooding situation now that he got to live in its results firsthand. Funny how things come around...
I would love to know how MRTSA feels about people being stranded in the rec center. No way out and no way in.
Elaine
Considering the comment about Brumfield being stranded at the Rec Center, maybe this is a good time for one of your polls Elaine.
Remember that ageless question-- if you were stranded on a deserted island, who would you want to be stranded with?.
Well, maybe for MTL it should be revised to:
If you were stranded at the Rec Center and your home was flooding, which Commissioner could you depend on to help you out?
Ordinance for collection of storm maintenance fee. Anonymous.
http://mtlebanon.org/DocumentCenter/Home/View/4076
Item D, page 2 is interesting 5:28.
I guess our brain-dead commissioners don't feel that tire crumbs made from old tires that the EPA doesn't allow to be dumped in ordinary landfills are a pollutant.
If Gateway was paid to prevent these situations during whatever it was they did at this intersection in the spring, they owe us a full refund. This is where they connected the pool pipes from the shaved hillside. I hope the people considering whether to grant the NPDES permit see this! Maybe it's time to look for a new engineering firm. Dieseroth has proven he is unqualified and/or incapable of providing the necessary services. Beware the municipal/engineering firm profit complex.
- Floodzone Freddy
Let's address the fundamental problems of our community before giving away all of the taxpayer's money to the magic turf peddlers... said no Commissioner ever.
When I drove through this area around 1130 today the roads were almost dry but the sewage smell was pretty strong.
Made me wonder how an artificial turf field would get cleaned after something like this.
How much would it cost to erect the old pool slide at the intersection of Morgan/Cedar? Then, when it rains, the Rec Dept. can charge a fee of $25 for stranded pool/park goers to exit. The funds can be used to pay to refill the crown jewel turf fields after all the rubber infill washes away. If the Rec Dept. is ambitious enough, it could set up a tube rental shack in the parking lot at Wildcat so residents can take a ride on the torrential waters of Cedar Creek. They could name it The Raging Rubber Crumb Rapids! A fleet of taxpayer-funded Escalades could return riders to the parking lot if they don't drown before making it to Gilkeson Rd.
- Wet Willie
No need for any of the Commissioners to rent an inner-tube. They could ride for free on their own hyper-inflated egos.
Not Kelly. I think she is the only one with a conscience. I will be scanning and sharing emails from the RTK as soon as I can.
And yes, today, Kelly visited homes in her ward and in other wards, which have recurrent flooding.
Elaine
Stormwater Management Act in PA from DEP and recourse to landowners in flooding situations. Anonymous.
http://www.elibrary.dep.state.pa.us/dsweb/Get/Document-87074/3930-BK-DEP0121.pdf
In researching legal opinions from other towns where storm water flooding had occurred, I noted that towns were found negligent in that the maintaince of existing storms drainage which damaged house and property. It's all well and good to have the Storm Flooding Ordinance ( which is require by Federal Law), but it's another matter when the Federal Law is deliberately not being followed. Talk is cheap, Commissioners! Do your d..n job, or resign!
Dear Wet Willie,
I think you are on to something here, good for you thinking outside that “fleece the taxpayers for our toys” box.
How about shooting a sequel to the first “Waterworld” movie right here in the great state of Lebo? All that additional revenue to our local restaurateurs from film crews frequenting their establishments will definitely outpace Silverman’s anticipated Gatorade boon! Who knows, maybe JAWS4 could follow with a new plot twist – the shark, living at the intersection of Cedar and Greenhurst, gobbles up unsuspecting pedestrians, tennis players or even Cedar homeowners when posing as a flower deliveryman! “LANDSHARK!!!”
-Susie Sailor
In my July 25, 2013 post, Commissioners: Stop and Face the Flood Waters, the cost that we were told was $700,000. Now, it will be AT LEAST $800,000 and since then, we had two more floods. Today and May 27, 2014.
Check out my May 27, 2014 post and see more pictures on May 28. Look at the photo of the wrinkled field. That's what happens when artificial turf gets flooded.
Elaine
Emily Harger? More like Enemy of the State! You and this Elaine Gillen are tools of the western propganda War on Turf machine! You use your Photoshopper program, no doubt a CIA creation, to manipulate photographs and video. All those living in the Empire of Mt.Lebanon know it has niy rained for years. You have been exposed for the liars you are.
Do you think our leaders would foolishly spend money they dont have on something that was not good for all? It's for the children, you capitalist dogs! How can you want to punish the children? If they must play their soccer and lacrosse, you must allow it. You mention sewage as a problem. Nonsense. It is a training tool. It will build their immune systems making them unbeatable and showing, finally, to all the South Hills we are the superior athletes.
No more lies, infidels. The location for turf is ideal. Our Minister of Engineering would not lie to us. Our Minister of Recreation would selflessly do what is best for the children. On to victory!
In all seriousness.
Anyone want to take a bet on when they raise the $8/month stormwater "fee?" (Remember it is not a tax even though for 100 years taxes took care of stormwater infrastructure.)
It is obvious that $8/month isn't enough to rectify the flooding.
In all seriousness, when they try to raise the fee that is actually a tax, I'm filing a legal challenge. Here's a thought--since we're being taxed on impervious surfaces, why don't the sports daddys get a nice fat bill for carpeting the fields? Then they can pass along that cost to the five dads who want to force, I mean "let", their children play in the rain.
Things are beginning to unravel, are they not, Dave B? You picked a real winning cause, pal.
6:48, on what grounds will you file a legal challenge?
Just curious.
To the first comment, I was one that was affected by this. Was driving to Home Depot and I usually take Cedar but I was blocked and had to go up Salem where police were diverting traffic. At that time and also an hour or so later, water was streaming from out under the man-hole storm water drains in the middle of the street! I have those pictures. It was literally gushing when I first drove by and was only streaming out when I was on my way back home.
After being diverted, I weaved my way around to Greenhurst to get a better view and sure enough, I saw what these pictures show. A bunch of cars were backed up the one drive heading up to the rec center. They were stuck.
Don't worry Elaine, adding a non-permeable surface like plastic grass and rubber tires won't impact this one bit. Not one bit.
11:42 AM, the current natural grass fields are totally permeable, as you know. However, the artificial turf fields, all 111,200 square feet of it, will have underground storm water collection pipes to collect storm water....the grass carpet will have thousands of drainage holes...and transmit it to the muni storm water pipes that empty into the main Cedar Blvd. system, already overloaded ! This will add or attempt to add to an already overloaded system upwards of 142,000 gallons of storm water into the Cedar system every time we have a heavy rainfall. If the artificial turfed fields did not have a storm water collection and dispersal capability, the fields would be totally non permeable and flood with every rainfall.
Ask the local criminals to explain this one.
The non-acceptance of irrefutable factual data by the Commissioners is the line of 'thinking' that prevails with the 'flat-earth' society.
I drove down Cedar Blvd. yesterday at 2:30pm and there were kids in the batting cages and a group of kids on the grass outfield at wildcat hitting baseballs. If those videos are in fact from yesterday at 10am, it certainly dried up quickly in the early afternoon sun.
1:56 - so much for the argument that we need artificial turf because our natural grass fields remain unplayable for days!
Irregardless of whether the videos are from yesterday or not - there is no denying we got a helluva lot of rain early in the morning.
Interesting that kids were shagging balls by 2:30pm.
Thank you, 1:18 PM. Here is a hyperlink to the Mount Sinai document. What to Know About Artificial Turf Fields
In the RTK, Dan Deiseroth cautioned use of the words "lead free" because there is no such thing, allegedly. "Andy" McNitt sent key points about US Standards for Lead Levels.
Elaine
The videos were from yesterday. Here is the WPXI news report with the same photo of Cedar. Only here, do we read asinine anonymous comments doubting their validity. That comment was made before he knew that Brumfield was one of the residents stuck at the Rec Center. Totally asinine, Buddy.
Elaine
The DEP recommends making videos and taking photographs of the problem areas. Here are the DEP's suggestions in resolving stormwater problems.
Elaine
All Commissioners of ML should pay close attention to this article! Anonymous.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2014-04-29/news/ct-flooding-lawsuit-bolingbrook-plainfield-tl-0501-20140429_1_will-county-flood-damage-lawsuit
Chapter 106 Flood Plan Management pacode.com Anonymous.
http://www.pacode.com/secure/data/025/chapter106/chap106toc.html
How dare you use these manipulated photos. If the photos weren't issued and approved by the Ministry of Information, they aren't representative of Airstrip One, er Mt. Lebanon. The shadow knows what you did, Elaine.
"The masses never revolt of their own accord, and they never revolt merely because they are oppressed. Indeed, so long as they are not permitted to have standards of comparison, they never even become aware that they are oppressed.”
― George Orwell, 1984
Wait a minute... there's a perfectly reasonable alternate explanation for yesterday's flooding AND the Brumfield Rec Center Sighting: It didn't rain, he simply got into the pool and all the water overflowed down onto Cedar Blvd.!
Makes perfect sense in contrast to the radical rain/photoshop conspiracy theories!
12:48 AM, also the artificial turf and track at the high school, in addition to the high school renovation.
Elaine
Nope, scratch my 7:36 AM comment. PCSM Plans are after November 19, 2010. The turf at the high school was installed July 2010 and it could be said that it is not a new earth disturbance. I have photos of the turf puddling, but it looks like another loophole.
Elaine
Any bets that our community-concerned PIO doesn't post Mount Sinai's "Tips for Safer Use of Artificial Turf Fields" or anything even remotely similar?
She's not answering, 10:52 PM, "or are you in charge now?"
Elaine
10:52 PM, when I get back to scanning more RTK stuff, you will learn that there is always a comeback from Dave Franklin concerning environmental issues. He writes, "If you look hard enough, there seems to be a study to support just about any theory."
But their only comeback to hard evidence of flooding is that it is old footage.
Elaine
I scanned the Dave Franklin email and added it to "You Can't Handle The Truth." Dave sent it to all the commissioners except Kelly Fraasch. Steve Feller then forwarded it to Phil Weis, Tom Kelley, and Dan Deiseroth.
Elaine
Why didn't he send it to Fraasch ?
Who is Dave Franklin and why do his opinions carry so much weight?
Plus, is this the reason Brumfiels said he didn't read any reports that had issues with artificial turf?
If the info doesn't come from Franklin, he doesn't bother to read it?
Is this the philosophy to which our 'Ministry of Enlightenment and Propaganda' subscribes too?
"That propaganda is good which leads to success, and that is bad which fails to achieve the desired result. It is not propaganda’s task to be intelligent, its task is to lead to success."
It doesn't take too much thinking to understand why Franklin didn't include Commissioner Fraasch.
What is scary is that President Linfante, the woman who campaigned as the the candidate that would "Listen, Collaborate, and Communicate" didn't immediately admonish Franklin that the Commission is comprised of five members not four!
Certainly speaks volumes about her character and leadership, doesn't it?
The fact that not one commissioner didn't call Franklin on his exclusion of Fraasch puts all of their ethics into question in my opinion.
Who is Dave Franklin, 11:30 AM? Dave is the non-voting member of the Sports Advisory Board who is married to a voting member of the SAB. Dave was on the Turf Project Task Force and who was tasked to make all the decisions, and is the Parks Advisory Board representative who never informed the PAB about the turf project. Eventually, the PAB found out about the turf project and gave their official statement of being against the turf project during a meeting when Dave was not present.
Does that help, 11:30 AM?
Elaine
No, it doesn't.
Why in a community of 32,000 people do Mr. & Mrs. Franklin get to wield so much influence on so many boards?
Did the Franklin's that lobbied so hard and for so long, write any donation checks for the private contribution for turfing?
Didn't see their names in the check list.
Speaking of private donations...
how about Brumfield, Silverman, Bendel, Morgans, Feller, Grogan etc. that all pushed for turf?
Not sure how many of the directors live in Lebo, but you'd think the residents that lobbied so hard for it would've put their money where their mouths were and lead with a check!
Franklin...weight...I see what you did. There. Ha.
The answer is simple. Franklin gets away with his antics because he can. Why can he? Because he has a buddy on the commission who throws his weight around and bullies the others. Who will stand up to him? Bendel? He doesnt know what's happening half the time. Silverman? He is still the wimpy geek in the halls who is afraid of the blowhard. Linfante? She just wants to be the popular girl so she sides with the bully.
If you want to eliminate people like Dave and Dave from the equation, get involved. Elaine preaches it, begs for it, on this blog. Yet people insist on hiding behind their keyboards. Get involved in the political process or stop complaining.
Keep checking my July 29, 2014 post "You can't handle the truth." I am adding more links to RTK documents.
Elaine
PA Storm Water Best Practices Management Manual. Rather lengthy. I'm wondering if our municipality is aware of this document/do they follow any of the guidelines?
Anonymous.
http://www.elibrary.dep.state.pa.us/dsweb/Get/Document-68851/363-0300-002.pdf
1:53 Bendel knows exactly what is going on. E x a c t l y.
1:53, I don't know- had I said why is Franklin such a big fish in a small pond... Why do Franklin's opinion have such an impact...would it be a big deal. Oh wait, another size reference-beat me for using common phrases to ask questions about a big player. Oops, did it again!
Question for you 1:53. Why is it always the assumption that an anonymous contributor here, isn't actively communicating with officials or participating in the political processes or donating to causes?
What that old saying-- if you assume it only makes an ass of u and me.
I hope 'anonymous' 1:53 you are actively engaged and not hiding behind your keyboard.
3:57 PM, what is the expression? "If the shoe fits, wear it." Every comment made here isn't about you. If it applies, so be it. If it doesn't, let it go.
Elaine
Just read the RTK regarding Franklin's opinion on the donor monument. Got to give hime credit on that one, he displayed some common sense.
But that email chain still causes some concerns for this taxpayer. Looking at the donations and the suggestion that fields fees might be varied based on the size of a sports groups contribution to the 'private' charitable fund.
In my mind that would be a highly unscupulous "quid pro quo" if it does become fee policy.
Anyone else bothered by that?
Point taken Elaine.
I'll just say there was no double entente intended. So I'll drop that topic.
I do thougjh get frustrated when I keep reading that the people that are engaged in your blog aren't involved.
I believe many are more involved than people suspect. More need to be for sure, attending SB and commission meetings, getting actively involved in politics and at the very least boning up on the issues and then --- voting.
"diffuse Kelly F"
WHO DO THESE PEOPLE THINK THEY ARE?
heard on the street ... local engineer creates water retention facility on cedar road to slow storm water in local streams ...
Wow. So our engineer screws up and then blames homeowners?
I can't seem to find the Gateway Feasibility Study on Stormwater that was to be available in 2013, according to this lebomag article, combating storm water runoff
I do know that the stormwater fee has been used for curb work and leaf collection. Ask residents on Shadowlawn how that storm sewer adjustment worked for them July 9, 2013.
I had asked Dan Deiseroth during Citizen Comments last year what could be done about the flooding on Cedar and I believe his response was there was nothing else that could be done.
Our tax, I mean, fee dollars at work. Nice.
Elaine
Swapping turf for grass is the next "Crown Jewel."
Turfing Wildcat/Middle is our only option for more field slots - Linfante to residents.
Nothing more can be done about flooding - Deiseroth to Gillen.
Is this the new Mt. Lebanon ethos?
Oh by the way Mr. Deiseroth, I'm sure those residents that have expeienced flooded homes from those regular 100 year storms, will want to thank you for keeping their homes' resale value high. Good job!
Elaine, this show's ML's response to required storm management plan submitted to Alcosan. I believe on the charts around 9.94 for Chartiers basin and subsequent charts, that the municipality decided to use original drainage (Cedar Blvd.) and not to spend money on improvements. If this is the case, why are we residents paying a "storm water" fee? Anonymous.
http://www.alcosan.org/Portals/0/Wet%20Weather%20Plan/Section%209.3.pdf
How they hell can they get away with adding almost 40,000 sq feet of impervious surface!!?!?!?
Well maybe the genius' at Gateway had something else in mind.
The site may not be in the 100-year flood plain. If you search hard enough, you might find the "Flood's Four Times a Year" flood plain.
Cedar at Greenhurst AKA Wildcat/Middle will be right there at the top of the list.
What I would like to see is the use of a Porous/Pervious concrete system on all parking lots in Mt Lebanon (school and municipality). This would not only help with stormwater runoff but it would give the appearance that these organizations actually care. The million or so dollars used for this turfing would have been a great start to help "green" Mt Lebanon the proper way. There are other ways to help with stormwater like green roofs, greywater retention systems, etc that would be a lovely way to lead the county in green techniques. The County and City governments would be willing to provide assistance to make Mt Lebo a truly "green" town.
Hey Damion - the high school project is required to have pervious paved sidewalks because of the fact that the project design exceeded the allowable non pervious area coverage in the Muni Zoning ordinance.
The specs for pervious pavement require annual wash down & scrubbing and inspection to ensure pervious standards are maintained.
Do you honestly believe the School District will comply with this and a muni inspection will even ever take place ?
The asphalt parking strip along the western side of Cedar at the Tennis Center is reportedly pervious. It's been up for 3 years. Ever seen it washed down and scrubbed ?
Well, of course not as there is no reason for me to be on Cedar, but that's not the point I wanted to make.
Obviously, there are a lot of problems in leadership in this municipality and the solution is actually very glaring. We need to clean house as soon as possible and re-evaluate positions to see if they are needed or not. If the person cannot (or in some people's instances will not) do their job correctly; they should be fired immediately. It happens in the private business world and it should happen (more often in my opinion) in the public world.
I know this will make the hits on my LinkedIn profile skyrocket. A person(s) from Mt Lebanon Government checks up on me almost every time I post.
Damion - that Lebo government person who checks up on you is very likely the PIO, probably with a voodoo doll and long pin in hand chanting your name. Do your ears itch or feel a brief stabbing pain at times?
For record keeping, Cedar flooded again today 8/12/14 and was closed by the police.
What is that-- the third or fourth 100 year storm this year?
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