My last post was focused on spending unassigned funds for deer management. In order to maintain some semblance of order, I am reposting Kelly Fraasch's proposal here for any turf discussions. Fraasch 2012 Unassigned Funds proposal Two hot topics on any one thread would have people complaining about reading through too many comments.
Kelly is proposing spending $389,700 to go toward eco-friendly turf. She is outvoted on artificial turf. It's all over but the cryin' on this issue too. Kelly points out that this would put the municipality into spending more than ONE MILLION DOLLARS into field improvements over the last two years.
Again, how much have the sports groups paid in municipal field fees? Zero. You want to talk about fairness?
43 comments:
Is this blog officially affiliated with Kelly Fraasch or is it unofficial? I'm confused.
If you remember, I published Kristen's deer culling presentation, as well as the YSA presentation. Are you still confused?
Elaine
Here is another little factoid to consider. The municipal website published the YSA proposal after I presented it here. They have yet to publish Kelly's:
Robb Hollow Park plan
Dog Park plan
Deer in Mt. Lebanon proposal
Recreation in Mt. Lebanon proposal
Yet, they published Kristen's plan. Kristen doesn't even have her deer killing proposal on her website. She does, however, tell us to read her article on page 35 of the July 2012 issue of Mt. Lebanon Magazine. It's all about listening/collaborating/communicating - in politics, music, and life.
Now, I am confused.
Elaine
$388,000 on turf but Kelly keeps a sub-standard golf course. What is she thinking?
Okay, now I'm also confused. Are you saying that the municipal website won't publish Kelly's plans?
Maybe Kristen and the YSA specifically asked the Muni to publish their plans and Kelly did not?
Maybe. It is just an observation.
Kristen's son is an ace baseball pitcher.
Read this about Brumfield.
http://hometeamsonline.com/teams/default.asp?u=LEBOLAX&t=c&s=htosports&p=coachprofile&coachID=18985
Bendel coaches basketball and baseball. http://votebendel.com/about/
Kristen wants deer killed and the boys want turf. It is a nice, tidy arrangement to get the necessary three vote majority.
Kelly wants a tractor for the golf course. What are you talking about? If you listen to Kristen's insane list of cuts which include cutting interest earnings, the first cut out of her mouth is with the golf course. The golf course generates revenue. This comment must be from Kristen.
You know, Kristen, you do have your own website. I'll even promote it for you. Valuemtlebanon.com
Elaine
I was looking at the 2012 budget and was trying to determine how much revenue the golf course actually generates?
Let us know, 3:09 PM. And while you are there, check to see how much revenue the ball fields generate. Include the revenue from the signage.
Elaine
I'm not trying to compare the two....I'm just curious what it is?
Is it $1, $1K, $100K, $1M....
Does anyone know?
When you're comparing the revenue generation of things like the golf course, ice rink, tennis facility and fields make sure to break out how much money eachactually "brings into the municipality" vs. money spent "BY" residents of the municipality.
Money spent on youth sports isn't really revenue since it's money really already here as Earned Income of the parents. The Commissioners can just as easily get their hands on it by raising taxes or increasing fees.
Greens fees, court fees, or ice fees on the other hand are often paid by people not living in the municipality and is therefore the only true revenue generation.
3:18 if you're not trying to compare the two why did you bring it up? And the golf course has been around a long time. Turf has not. Where is the community support for artificial turf? Why would our town spend money on something so few can use? What are the "revenue" projections for the fields once they're turfed? How does this improve the community as a whole?
Might try thinking before you write next time.
3:18 PM,
From ..
MT. LEBANON, PENNSYLVANIA
COMPREHENSIVE ANNUAL FINANCIAL REPORT
YEAR ENDED DECEMBER 31, 2012
Golf course, 2012 revenue: ........$467,457
Golf course, 2012 expenditures: $390,710
Profit/Loss (+/-) ..........................+$76,747
It would sure save me time if you could look this up on your own. Not trying to be disrespectful, but the information is out there.
Elaine
Again....I'm not trying to compare the two.
I am asking the question to determine if there is an opportnuity to potentially leverage the golf course model across other municipal facilities.
If the revenue is nominal, it may not be worth exploring.
My question is not related to turf, which I do not support.
And for some perspective:
Comprehensive Annual Financial Report for the year 2012
+Recreation:
Recreation center................. 1,477,653
Golf course............................... 467,457
Tennis center............................ 231,922
Seasonal programs................ 525,628
Total recreation.................... 2,702,660
-Culture and Recreation:
Recreation management....... 299,385
Recreation center................ 1,396,546
Golf course.............................. 390,710
Tennis center........................... 181,863
Seasonal programs............... 435,126
Total culture and recreation 2,703,630
Total Profit/Loss (+/-)...................-$970
from all recreation sources
Elaine
Indoor tennis has been extremely generous with their donations.
Elaine
4:55 that is a good question, $76,000 from the golf course is nothing to sneeze at. I mean someone opinioned that the PBT $10,000 prize wasn't chump change.
So how do we investigate this modeling that you brought up before the commissioners vote and burn through the $800,000+?
We do have a model of commissioners hasty actions in the field sign ordinance. Do we let them rush into more?
We went to see a judge last year because we didn't have enough money to fund the Municipality under our Home Rule Charter. Are you now exposing the fact that we lied to a judge to get money for turf?
Wait. What?
Elaine
I think it is funny how much focus on Kelly when she is the only one sharing an actual path for the municipality.
The other lemmings go along to get along. Matt will do his meerkat imitation and stick his head out of the hole and stand against something once in a while (as he will I think in the case of the unassigned funds) but mostly it is just a train that keeps moving forward. The other three march to the beat of the same drummer (and you know his name!)
This blog has a lot of "Kelly" content because she actually puts stuff out there and has ideas that move things. You can't ask for your commissioner to be "open and transparent" during election season and then attack that commissioner when they are actually being "open and transparent".
All the stuff presented on this blog for and about the commissioners has been made available either at the municipal website or on the commissioner blogs. Is it really that hard to put 2+2 together? I'd rather you thank Kelly and go ask the other four commissioners where their plans are!
Where are their plans for:
1. Deer culling
2. Public safety
3. Parks
4. The Trid
5. Road maintenance
6. Pensions
7. Health Care
Get the damn deer off the table so we can actually talk about stuff that matters! Of all the things the commission needs to worry about, deer has got to be about the least important. Yet it feels like 80% of our time is talking about deer culling and the other 20% is turf.
On the unassigned funds, I'd rather see the money go to pay down debt. Simple as that. It shouldn't be a chance for commissioners to fund their pet projects.
All five commissioners are wrong on what they want to do with it. Matt is closest by wanting to give it back, but that is just not feasible unless you somehow perpetually put that into law.
Kelly Fraasch has updated her blog and goes into greater detail about unassigned funds. Unassigned Funds from 2012
As soon as the other commissioners do the same, I will announce their updates.
Elaine
It is obvious Kelly belongs to the FREE LUNCH party. If she were in the State Legislature her list of WANTS would be labeled a Christmas Tree List.
Kelly, the last time I inquired, the debt service at the swimming pool exceeded the revenues. Yet a boatload of our money is going to the bottom of the ML Pool. How big can you make a debt hole, Kelly?
8:47 AM, we have three additional commissioners who are card carrying members of the free lunch party. Two of them are on record to overspend on the high school project. Why do you continually single out Kelly?
Matt Kluck is the only one who wants to give the money back to the people.
Elaine
Elaine, A better question is why are you so protective of Kelly? The woman can't say NO! and until she can, Kelly won't help to put this community on a sound fiscal footing. It takes two to kill another bond issue and Kelly would have Matt's vote.
In short, you can't continue to defend Kelly and complain about high taxes and sub-standard community services as long as you are defending a tax-and-spend commissioner.
Then you are unaware of the fact that the Home Rule Charter is being changed by staff and will be voted on by the commission and only taking three votes to eliminate super votes. There will be no more four votes required for anything. I guess Kelly did that one all by herself too.
Elaine
Guess why you already don't have turf on Wildcat/Middle? That's right, it's because Kelly said "no" last year.
Stop making things up. She is far less of a worry than the majority on the commission who actually WILL vote to spend money on anything and everything.
If we have an $800,000 unused fund balance why are we fretting over a new pay-as-you-thro garbage collection plan?
Pay the increase, it can't possibly be going up over $800,000, and if it is find a new collection firm.
The current plan works well, people seem to want it and apparently the current municipalble mileage rate is sufficient to cover a realistic increase.
Who needs a complicated, time consuming PAYT garbage plan. Keep the current collection plan without raising taxes (we're already being overcharged according to unused funds the past two years).
Or give the unused funds back to the taxpayers as Mr. Kluck suggest.
Another question is why we are paying a new storm water fee yet storm water handling seems to be getting worse instead of better.
Last week's storm was bad. but it wasn't a "once in 100 year storm."
"Unassigned funds" implies savings for an individual, but for a governmental entity that should read "surplus" or "overtaxed balance."
Here are pictures of the military disrespected by the ML Commission's refusal to finish the Vets Memorial.
http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=9dR3h2HdnBQ
John Ewing
John,
The Commissioner's decision to buy turf when the sidewalks are buckling, the streets look like Berma Road, the sewers leak and Bird Park is in ruin is beyond funny - it's tragic!
I really think that Mt Lebanon needs a severe financial crisis. Maybe through experience our young elected officials will learn why we fix our roads, sidewalks, and sewers before we turf; and we never forget the individuals who gave everything so that they can have the freedom to make that choice!
John David Kendrick
what would you say to your teenage child who wanted to spend every penny they had managed to accumulate? we need to keep in mind that once we buy the luxuries that some people want to get with other people's money, we will all have to maintain, repair, and eventually replace the stuff -- not to mention that every "advance" will beget a new "now we 'need'" item to spend on....is there a plan, or just a bottomless pit?
this discussion is really not about who on the commission is most fiscally responsible when they will not even take a vote on the stewardship of our municipal manager's tenure, even after the white-washed debacle of the public safety building, etc.! where is anyone on the termination of that overpaid and ineffective employee?
There is no plan. We have seen people at commission meetings saying with puppy dog eyes how we need to turf McNeilly Park because as Brumfield told us, how do you turn away five year olds because they have no place to play soccer? We have seen petitions where people are asking to turf Wildcat and Middle fields because we have no multipurpose fields. The commission then upgrades Brafferton to a multi purpose field. Then we see how the commission must fund turfing a school district field and nobody thought to ask the school board what their opinion was. Which will now take us back to turfing Wildcat and Middle fields.
They don't know what the heck they want. They just want turf somewhere. Anywhere!
After they turf Wildat and Middle, McNeilly, Mellon, they will be back onto turfing Bird and Robb Hollow. Brumfield, Bendal, and Linfante are insatiable. And they have three votes and unassigned funds at their fingertips to do it.
Elaine
With Brumfield running unopposed, and Bendel and Linfante have two more years and what three (?) more budgets, they will be able to pull it off.
Elaine
Here's a thought. Why dont all you people who complain with your keyboard start getting involved and push back? Nobody, with the exception of Elaine, speaks at the meetings to express their opinion. Instead everyone remains silent while stupid ideas are proposed and then complain because those stupid ideas gain traction. Quit being such cowards. What are you afraid of? The commissioners wont allow you on the parking board? They'll glare at you at public events? There is nothing any of them can do to affect you individually so stop hiding. We need people to attend the meetings and speak up. Otherwise we'll continue watching our money be spent on the dumbest crap imaginable like artificial turf.
Did Feller get the job done?
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1129&dat=20010801&id=SYkNAAAAIBAJ&sjid=fHADAAAAIBAJ&pg=6316,383016
12:06 PM, unless you are one of the handful of people who speak at commission meetings, I wish you would speak up at a meeting.
Let me tell the readers what they are up against. Everyone has five minutes to speak. If you are lucky, you will not be interrupted by Kristen. With Kristen being president next year, it will be more difficult to speak. She will cut you off with a terse "Thank you." This year, President Matt will be respectful, although if you are talking against deer culling, Kristen WILL cut you off.
Talking against turf will get you nowhere. It is a done deal. The way our government is set up, there is nothing we can do about that. They will spend any surplus as they see fit. That translates to, we will spend your money on our pet projects and you can't do a damn thing about it.
If you feel that there are staff members who should go, the only person who can get rid of them is Manager Feller. The only ones who can get rid of Manager Feller are the commissioners.
There is only one commissioner who has an active blog/ website. Ward 5 seems to luck out that way. But I won't mention any names because then the trolls come out.
A constituent told me about a current commissioner who actually said that he will vote the way he wants.
This is who we now have representing us. The commissioners who are out there pulling weeds around the Veterans Memorial or stacking bricks on both sides of Castle Shannon Blvd., which had heaved and floated down the street, are demonized here. That same commissioner, along with her family, drove throughout Mt. Lebanon - not just her ward, after the storm offering to help families clean up.
But the people on their keyboards who demonize her, would never think to help anyone. I never saw the Ward 3 commissioner assessing damages on our street. My neighbors were hit hard. But where is Kristen? She is tracking deer "incidents" on her map.
By the way, the area around Wildcat and Middle flooded again. So let's put turf there, right guys?
Elaine
Youre making my point for me. One or two people feeling defeated is understandable. But what if every meeting there were six or ten residents speaking up? Wouldnt be quite as easy to dismiss them.
People need to wake up. Government has gone too far.
I just watched the end of the commission discussion session and the subject of canceling block parties at Halloween came up. Brumfield didn't think block parties should be cancelled at Halloween. He thought Halloween should be treated just like any other day. The Police Chief had to explain to the commissioners that there is more child traffic on the streets that night before Dave understood the danger to kids and the problems of re-routing traffic to other streets during block parties.
He also wants to put doggie poop in Williamsburg Park on a trial basis.
http://www.sportsfieldmanagementmagazine.com/article-8029.aspx
Before our commissioners get hot and bothered over turf, maybe some advice from experienced pros can help. See the link above for:
"Sports Field Management - April 2012
Turf Trends
A Pro's Perspective
Industry Veterans Weigh In On Turf Topics"
Some good points to think about pro and con for natural or artificial turf. A question to be asked is will either one be properly maintained and what procedures will be put in place to insure we get our money's worth.
Take a look at how we maintain(not) the high school turf -- holding graduation ceremonies, hundreds of metal chairs, podiums, tables, high heels, gum chewing/spitting out, all of which violate and therefore cancel the costly warranty, will add maintenance costs and reduce the life of the turf ! Remember what happened to the prior turf - it lasted only 6 years out of a normal 8-10 year life.
8:22 thought it was 7 years, but you're probably right. That's why I hope our officials read the link provided by 8:21.
Ross Kurcab, CSFM, Turf Manager for the Denver Broncos offers some good advice in http://www.sportsfieldmanagementmagazine.com/article-8029.aspx, for our elected officials which ever way we go on fields.
"The more a field is used, the faster it will wear out. Budgeting for fields is based on an expected life span, so usage needs to be evaluated and events may need to be prioritized to maximize field life. A high-end, sand-based, natural grass field is designed to meet high expectations. It has higher inputs in labor and materials. The payoffs of that are the performance and aesthetics. Yet, it's not a stable environment and can crash harder and faster than a native-soil field with lower inputs. For artificial fields, the projected life span may range from 6 to 12 years. Each entity needs to determine its long-range expectations, including at what point replacement is needed in terms of safety and playability, and build that into the equation when determining what type field fits best."
Our fields apparently were mismanaged or poorly maintained considering the high use for years and it caught up with us.
Don't know what is different or who is paying attention, but this year Mellon at least looks better than it has in years. Though it does still have some standing water.
So hopefully our leaders will follow Mr. Kurcab's advice and not only think about today and but also formulate long-range maintenance and replacement plans. We can't continue buy it and forget it strategies any more.
He also writes the following.
"I'm also seeing a trend where a municipality or school can apply for state funds for construction of artificial fields, but not for any maintenance/renovation needs for natural grass fields. While that can be useful, are there going to be funds available when replacement is needed?"
Has this been investigated, though we've probably tapped the state for more than they can handle already?
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