Mon 8 pm Commission mtg includes public hearing on capital investment. To see possible items: http://www.mtlebanon.org/documentcenter/view/9596
The Mt. Lebanon Commission will conduct a capital investment hearing on Monday, July 22, 2013 beginning at 8 p.m. in commission chambers, 710 Washington Road. The purpose of the hearing is to solicit input on the use of unassigned fund balance over the 10% threshold, which as of December 31, 2012, totaled $829,561.
The big ticket item is Athletic field improvements/turf $700,000...for Mellon Middle School. That's right. The commission majority wants to spend municipal tax dollars on a School District field. Of course. Where is Brumfield's or Linfante's or Bendel's proposal? Does it matter that Brumfield and Bendel are coaches?
Other athletic improvements include another $200,000 Additional swim center improvements. Can anyone say...Climbing Wall? We just took out a Rec Bond for the pool!
Is it going to be another meeting of sports parents with puppy dog eyes saying that Lebo is not spending enough on athletics? This is making me sick.
101 comments:
Someone from Upper St Claire once commented to me that in Mt Lebanon we spend money like we have it
$700,00+$200,000+$133,000=$1,033,000!
Is this some more of that new math that school board directiors rely on? Like a .56 mill increase = a zero mill increase.
How do they think THEY have $829,561 to spend and come up with a plan that spends $1,033,000?
And befor one those nice Lebo community members writes to tell me the municipality is only covering a portion of the $700,000 turf job-- yeah I know that.
Question is "WHO'S PAYING THE BALANCE?" until you lock that up it's not a plan!
Obviously, they can't have it all. But this is the annual meeting of the kiddies in their uniforms, the jock dads, and the soccer moms. If it isn't turfing McNeilly, turfing Wildcat and Middle, changing the sign ordinance for signage around the fields, it wll be for turfing Mellon. They will all be out.
The sports groups will make their empty promises and pledge to help fund. The SD will probably offer to use their new fundraising dollars. Since they're going to wrap bonds, they won't need any $ from fundraising for the high school project. It is all a scam.
Elaine
Bingo!
If we had management at the municipality we would have some balance in the spending.
Mount Lebanon will go the way of Detroit and we have the municipal managers to thank for that.
By the way, Matt Kluck's name is no longer posted as the golf professional at he municipal golf course. Does anybody know why?
Anyone to take odds on how soon we'll see touching photos of kids playing sports and high giving while text will expose the benefits of exercise and sportsmanship.
Like none of that can happen without mommy and daddy waiting with Hugs,, healthy snacks and "you played great honeys."
You can be surehere weren't be any photos of the still yndeveloped Twin Hills or McNeilly wood lots or text informing us how much we still owe on these "athletic" promises.
Correction:
Anyone ready to take odds on how soon we'll see touching photos of kids playing sports and high giving while text will expose the benefits of exercise and sportsmanship, in Lebomag?
The magazine is supposed to be an unbiased information source for the community... we'll see if we get an accurate portrayal of all the facts in this story.
Forget the turf at a school district field. I think the town should invest in McNeilly and develop it into a comprehensive sports facility that all field sports can enjoy. We are going to places like USC to play because we don't have the space. Put a couple million into McNeilly we would have a really nice space with fields.
10:47 AM, don't you worry. That will be next. After they get their precious turf at Mellon. The commissioners are upgrading Brafferton. Will that help your situation?
Elaine
it's all about power, not respect for the community and diversity of opinion....
The sports people can't agree. Except every last dime must be spent on sports here and none of it benefits older residents.
Elaine
10:47 you've got 15 athletic fields now and don't pay one cent in fees for their use ! And we're about to spend $130,00 more on Brafferton upgrades plus $140,000 for paved parking at Wildcat. How obnoxious you and your ilk are !
Ohhh, and the cost to develop McNeilly into what you want/demand is now over $3.5 million. You and your athletic supporters willing to come up with $1.0 to $2.0 million or more up front ? And pay user fees for operating costs ? Of course not you deadbeat !
All i can say is, if the commissioners spend all that public money on a public field, the public damn sure gets to use it. How much is Dave Franklin kicking in? And im not clearing my uae of the field with some wanna-be jock living vicariously through his kid. The first time im denied use of the public field im initiating litigation. This'll be fun. Good luck, sports geeks. You've just opened the door for a battle. I'll make sure nobody can use the fields. Thats how this works, right? You cry loud enough and you get your way? Well, i wont cry. I'll just make sure the stupidity of his entire process is highlighted.
Too bad the sports people didn't consider the Rob Hollow plan that Commissioner Fraasch put forward. At the very least more than the sports folk would have been able to enjoy the space and they would have had their fields. Now we are looking at investments that ONLY benefit the sports. With little effort toward making what looks like a landfill not a park of use for all residents.
10:47 ask Lebomag to show you the results of the Doggie Park poll. Everybody is real quick to want stuff, and the public emplyees are all to anxious to agree, but nobody wants to come up with a financing plan or the money to pay for this stuff.
It's always- we'll spread the cost around to everyone, even those people that don't think it's a necessity. If those naysayers complain, theyshoulg get out is the refrain.
So 10:47, you want a comprehensive sports facility, show us your damn plan to pay for it!
Be forewarned, if it means higher taxes for me, I'm not supporting it.
STATE FIRING TEACHERS WHILE WE BUILD SPORTS FIELDS IN FACE OF DECLINING ENROLLMENT.
Stagnant state subsidies and declining enrollments are threatening jobs at several universities in Pennsylvania's State System of Higher Education.
Faculty leaders said employees of six state universities, including Clarion and California universities in Western Pennsylvania, received letters notifying them that faculty and staff positions could be cut to balance the budget this fall.
“Money is the bottom line,” said Elizabeth McDaniel, president of the faulty union at Clarion University, 80 miles northeast of Pittsburgh. She identified the other four state schools as Cheney, East Stroudsburg, Edinboro and Mansfield universities.
Systemwide, state subsidies declined from $484 million in 2007-08 to $412.7 million in 2011-12. They have remained flat since.
. . . .
mainstay programs, including English, physics, biology, psychology and education, as “programs or departments of concern,” saying they exceeded their budgets by at least 10 percent or failed to produce expected credit hours of instruction.
. . .
Enrollment declines are a doubled-edged sword for schools, which rely on tuition money and receive state support based in part on enrollment. This month the Board of Governors, which oversees the State System of Higher Education's budget, slashed Clarion's state subsidy by $551,423 because of a 3 percent drop in enrollment in 2012.
The school expects again to record a decline in enrollment this fall, McDaniel said.
Declining enrollment is a concern for colleges across Pennsylvania. - - - The pool of new high school graduates peaked at 131,000 in 2010 but is expected to keep shrinking through 2020. - - -
Theater professor Michael Slavin heads the faculty union at California University, where officials are juggling a $7 million deficit. He said staffers there received notices of possible job cuts last week.
Read more: http://triblive.com/news/education/4389393-74/state-enrollment-faculty#ixzz2Zc2wc3ts
Follow us: @triblive on Twitter | triblive on Facebook
2:48 PM, the beauty of the commission majority's plan is that they can upgrade school fields with municipal money so that there are no teachers cut.
Remember when the school district took Mt. Lebanon to court over the high school project? We paid for both sides. Well, it is happening again. We're paying twice for school athletics. And Brumfield, Linfante and Bendel are happy to do it.
Elaine
I like 10:47's McNeilly idea. Sports facilities are not just for children. There are many older (that includes me) folks who use the pool and the golf course.
The big question is why are they happy to do it? Spend nearly a million dollars on turf... Why? So kids can play sports? What have al the generations of Mt. Lebanon kids been doing up to now been doing, playing mumbly peg?
So after they get turf, you can't have turf without $300,000 or $400,000 in energy consuming, environment polluting stadium lights (gee where's the save the planet ESB) because you still can't play in the dark!
So now we're into abother $1.3 million sports investment and we've done nothing with the Twin Hills/McNeilly sports investments!!!
There's some real progressive thinking going on here.
There isn't enough room for chipping and pitching practice at the golf course. Let's use McNeilly, Brafferton, Mellon, Jefferson, Wildcat, Dixon, and any other municipally funded field for golf practice. Forget the permit fees, we already paid for them, some twice, and we paid for something we can't use at the golf course.
4:12 great, come up with a plan!
If I want to play golf with cart it cost around $20 a round. If I want to join a golf league I play even more.
I want to go swimming I pay for a pool pass. My kid wants to join the swim club it cost even more.
So you want us to build you a McNeilly Sports Complex -- show us the money!!!
McNeilly? That's it, let's put money into a facility that will be difficult to get to. Just because some inept commissioner's spent money on it doesn't mean we have to throw more money after it.
Turfing Mellon? Has anyone really done an analysis to see what the true needs are and what turfing Mellon buys us? It is multiple fields or is it just one?
Again, I'm willing to consider plans if there is some thorough analysis behind it. Can't say I'd support it, but would just love someone to do a true needs analysis so we can all make decisions based on fact.
Seeking financial balance in Mount Lebanon is like selling crucifixes in Kabul. Thanks Daves!
"Oh where oh where will the children play" if we don't turf fields and build multiple-use athletic facilities.
Let the parents move if they don't like the athletic facilities. They will still bitch about it wherever they go.
Brumfield, Linfatne, and Bendel are nasty vote trading double-crossing bastards.
Thanks for the inspiration, 5:27.
Sung to Cat Stevens "Where Do The Children Play"
Well we think it's fine to make Lebo plans
Or taking a ride with our money train
switch on summer with a kids athletic game
yes get what you want cuz you'll find ways to get it anyway.
(chorus)
I think Lebo's going away
Since you need to add to it every day,
But tell us, why does it always have to be YOUR WAY?
Well, you'll roll over fields of fresh mown grass,
but you know your sporty loads create unearthy carbon gas
you make 'em green and you make 'em tough,
but you go on and on and never get enough
(repeat chorus)
Well your unlimited borrowing has cracked the sky, tax bills fill the air
but you'll keep on building till there's no life 'round here
You make us laugh and cause a many to cry
Will you also tell us when to leave and when to die
chorus)
I think Lebo's going away since you need to add to it every day,
But tell us, why does it always have to be YOUR WAY!
And yes we need to find some hard headed women because then life will be as it should!
Detroit, Chicago, Oakland, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Los Angeles, Houston, and Mount Lebanon are beginning to look alike financially. When employees are fired, Steinhauer, Feller, Donnellan, and Morgans can all blame the financial problems on retired staff. GOOD WORK, GUYS!
Don't forget the city of Harrisburg, PA which the legislature will have to bail out.
Right under our state representative's noses and they coldn't keep an eye on it.
http://mobile.nationaljournal.com/economy/harrisburg-pa-votes-to-file-for-bankruptcy-20111012
As you read this article and hear spendthrift democrats criticize Corbett for not spending more money on education, remember where the Governor gets his money to dole out--- from you!
Pay attention also that all these cities have been run by the democrats for many years. But as we're experiencing here, the Rino's don't have much fiscal restraint either.
the lyrics are stupid. just saying, not a fan...anytime
9:31 entitled to your opinion
Spending $2 million for Twin Hills and McNeilly and turfing a field without a well defined plan is just stupid, not a fan of wasteful spending any time...just satin.
...just saying! Not satin.
947... i respect your opinion. I just think that the person posting lyrics needs to find his life's work.
You're right 10:55. We'll go back to comments like those at 12:21 and 1:03.
That's a much better way to win friends and influence people.
When we're talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars in new recreation spending why is their no discussion about rectifying deteriorating roads and fixing stormwater runoff that flooded peoples homes.
No the sports people must have their play dates.
Remember a few years ago the commissioners wanted to float bonds to pave streets. If we have unused taxes why wouldn't we use that money to pave rather than borrowing and paying interest on a bond to do something the municipality should be doing in the first place?
Turfing a field isn't a municipality obligation, paving streets, maintaing infrastructure is. If they don't want to pave streets... Reduce or eliminate the stormwater fee.
About the deterioating roads, Steve Feller mentioned that his is pleased with the system in place which identifies the roads in disrepair and has a schedule set up for those roads for the next twenty years or whatever that timetable is.
About the namecalling. You earned it, Buddies. The way I look at it, it is all we have left. You are getting your damn turf. Suck it up and take the namecalling. We have to pay for it now, pay to maintain it, and then pay to replace it. I think you deserve a few choice words.
Elaine
New math...
13,000 homes x $8/mo stormwater fee= $468,000.
$104,000 x 4 quarters = $1,872,000
The commissioners collected $830,000 in excess taxes this year, they had $1.2 million extra last year. Doesn't look like there was a pressing need for an $8/mo stormwater fee does it. Could probably cover stormwater problems with an annual $8-10 fee + unused taxes.
No we have to build more stuff to maintain down the bumpy road and streets.
Plus, of that $8 fee collection they pay >$6,200 to send put the bills, pay Weinstein to manage the collection fee and households spend $6,200 to send in their checks.
Are we idiots or what?
They always ha a timetable to maintain roads, then somehow, some way it bece someones bright idea to borrow money to pave streets.
So rather than doing something with the excess taxes like getting a head of the paving schedule or banking it to get ahead of a jump in asphalt prices, our leaders think they have money burning a hole in their pockets.
Not even paid for out of the excess funds- $133,000 for paving and parking at Brafferton.
Bricks washed out on Castle Shannon, a brick road that should've been replaced or at least reset years ago.
Which needs immediate attention and serves the greatest number of residents?
Fellers pleased with the road repair schedule? Really!
Who ever coined the phrase "wingnuts" was dead on. No wonder you are ignored by everyone in this community, except by your 4 chorus members who keep singing the same song. WE ARE RIGHT! YOU ARE WRONG! We would never dare to run for office, but we rather sit in our cave wearing our tinfoil hats and throw acorns at the sun.
Aww, man!!! You put me on such a roller coaster ride! I go from having four readers to ten readers to being the most powerful, back to four readers. The next comment will be how I write all the comments, including yours.
You are hilarious. Why do you bother?
Elaine
They're back!!!
Never run for office, how did you come up with that factoid? Elaine ran for office, Stephenson, Cannon, Wertheim, Bies, James Fraasch, Mark Hart, Hill, Brown and Goldman. We know how he's been treated for stepping up. Hill offers an honest view here of state education money and the cabal drops him like a bad habit.
Many commenters here volunteer on local committees on a regular basis, but you keep up your transparent worn out PR campaign to ostracize your neighbors.
Does your wingnut name calling make you feel like a big man or woman? It certainly foes bring anything of value to the conversation.
11:46 erupts with: "No wonder you are ignored by everyone in this community, except by your 4 chorus members who keep singing the same song."
11:28 ask an obvious question considering the washboard condition of Castle Shannon Blvd from the library down to Scott Rd and 11:46 is Johnny on the spot with the name calling. No facts just name calling. Why is that?
They say the community ignores this blog, that their are only four tinfoil hatted wingnuts, yet somehow it scares them... wonder why? The question that proceeded their boring tirade was if Fellers was satisfied with street maintenance. Now we can't ask anything?
12:26 PM. Every once in a while, I like to throw a few crumbs to the trolls. I actually look forward to these comments because it tells me that I am touching a nerve. They are nervous. I know that the turf is a done deal, but they don't seem to think so. If anything, this encourages me to continue.
Elaine
11:46 says Elaine's blog is ignored by the community!
Elaine, puts up a community oriented poll and gets 100, 150, 200 opinions in a matter of days.
Lebomag puts up a poll and is lucky if it gets 20?
Amazing!
http://www.npr.org/2012/05/10/152437462/debate-should-college-football-be-banned
Malcolm Gladwell was on CNN talking about the danger of college football and the degeneration of the brains from the sport. Did you know that Penn has reduced the number of training sessions per week?
If the DAS are so concerned about the welfare of the kids then why aren't we having more consideration of the long-term medical effects from these violent sports?
The problem is that we aren't having this discussion because the sports are for the middle age men that are frustrated jocks and not for the kids!
Give 'em hell Elaine!
The middle age men can't get over their mediocre talent in their junior years so they try to relive their failures at the expense of their children. Lock you doors. Here come the DAS who just couldn't measure up.
I sure wouldn't want my children's lives destroyed because a bunch of overweight frustrated jocks are trying to re-live their childhood!
Well, these middle age, frustrated jocks are controlling our tax dollars. Two thirds of our commissioners who want artificial turf are coaches. And we're supposed to be quiet?
Elaine
Sorry to break with the consensus here, but that is all it's about, frustrated jocks?
Sure, I'll bet that plays a role, but I'll bet ego and should we call it 'prestige' plays a bigger role. Could money play a role as well, not in the kinda of money under the table, skimming off the top kinda of moola, but look at my resume, I'm a big fish in a small pond so I'm qualified for even bigger ponds.
As for the municipal staff, the more stuff they need to manage the more essential they become, the more essential the better the security and paycheck, so they're certainly not going to side with not building new stuff. It's not in their interest.
The real divide in Mt. Lebanon is not between those who want turf and those who do not, or those who want a $113,000,000 high school and those who do not; the real divide is between A)those people who reflexively trust and worship local government and B)those people who recognize that local government poses a great threat to both their wallets and their liberties. The latter group may get hyper at times, but the former group consists of "omnipotent moral busybodies," to quote C. S. Lewis. OMB's are very generous with other peoples' money.
Unfortunately, group A usually gets what they want because they send more people to the polls than group B, and in this town the phrase "more people" represents around 18% of all registered voters. Two-thirds of our benighted polity does not vote, and I would be surprised if they could name even one commissioner or director! They are here for the "buffet," will depart when they've had their fill, and leave the "check" to those who stay behind.
4:16 PM, yes, that definitely plays a big part in this. Dave Brumfield started the turf advisory board, I mean, the sports advisory board. Ward 4 is going to reelect him in November. He is running unopposed. Ward 4 can't come up with an opponent? The Republican Committee of Mt. Lebanon can't come up with an opponent? We get to hear about "Field Failure" for four more years. I am willing to bet he is the one presenting the $700,000 turf plan. We know it isn't Matt. He wants to give the money back. Kelly is on record for a compromise of a $390,100 public/private partnership for turf. I doubt it is coming from John or Kristen because I have yet to see any sort of plan from them. They just go along with whatever Dave has worked out.
We're also going to hear a plan for additional swimming pool improvements of $200,000. We haven't even started to improve the pool, and now Donnellan wants more. Talk about job security and building new stuff!
Do you see a pattern developing? We say yes to field improvements (Brafferton) but we need MORE field improvement. We say yes to pool improvements but we need MORE pool improvements. We say yes to a six lane swimming pool for the high school, but we have to have eight. The greed just never ends.
Elaine
You forgot to add Elaine, that along the way to these vast improvements money is no object. Studies, purchased properties sitting vacant, alliances, nanatorium designs all for naught after millions thrown into these pie in the sky dreams.
11:46 talks about throwing acorns at the sun. At least that doesn't cost people money. 11:46 keeps throwing bushels of paper money at blank walls and hoping it'll stick.
Who's the wingnut?!
11:46, your syntax has such a familiar ring to it. I'm pretty sure I know who you are. Very original use of all the key phrases. But I don't understand the nastiness. If you don't like the blog, why are you on it? If it's just for "wingnuts" and conspiracy theorists, then why read it?
People who comment on this site, by and large, don't want to run for office based on the behavior of others in our community. My school board run was fraught with juvenile and disgusting behavior on the part of alleged church-goers and sitting elected officials. Other who have run have experienced the same thing. So run for office? Why should anyone have to suffer through such nonsense in order to do what's right for the town?
The turf idea/proposal highlights what we "wingnuts" see as the problem: government that represents themselves, not the community overall. The school board, a pretty much unaccountable group, decided to plunge Mt. Lebanon into debt via irresponsible spending despite overwhelming opposition to the project. They, as a group, flat out lied to get their way. And there was no actual basis for a new school except to pat themselves on the back. No evidence a new building would improve academic performance, no data to support maximizing the proposed square footage including enrollment numbers (which they were told are projected to decline and then ignored said numbers), and no visible support other than literally a handful of people ( a "chorus" of 20?), most of whom were related to school board members.
The turf proposal is exactly the same. There is a tiny group of individuals who have the notion stuck in their heads that artificial turf for children is better than grass. They have shown no demonstrable evidence to support the idea, there is no data that shows turf somehow enhances or improves performance as well as the experience, and there has been vocal opposition to the idea (you might recall I delivered a pretty basic presentation outlining why turf is a bad spend for our town). The topper is, the group who pitched the idea isn't contributing to it. Yet it appears that once again, public dollars will be spent on something unnecessary in order to satisfy a few who have painted the idea as a need instead of what it is--a pure luxury.
I would run for office again if I thought it would make a difference or prompt a change in direction. It wouldn't. There would have to be a complete changeover in the complexion of the Commission. Not happening for a number of reasons. In the meantime, 11:46, you and your ilk need to accept we are also taxpayers and thus, we have a seat at the table. That includes articulating our opinion when we feel our money is being wasted or spent in a manner that does not reflect the majority of those who contributed. So stop with the anonymous sniping. If you'd like to have a real debate or discussion, I think everyone here is willing to do so.
Well written Mr. Cannon.
11:46 also fails to recognize that a group of residents tried to initiate a "town hall". Whether it was rightly named, it was attempted and packed the commission room.
What was the response a demonstration to sabotage the effort. No, let's work together people, let's build a community, no welcome we're glad you're getting involved. No it was received with "what the Kluck!"
Lebowitz's wife heavily promoted the "town hall" massacre and "what the Kluck!" crap. Have her e-mail blast.
Really wonderful people in the bubble
9:11 PM, she was in the photos that made the paper too. Isn't it nice to know that most of those people are now government officials?
I hadn't seen that email blast. We live in such a wonderful community. Also the ones who were promoting the "How to Disagree without Being Disagreeable" seminar are my rudest commenters.
Elaine
Richard Gideon summarized this situation very well. The current tribe leading Lebo represents a minority opinion. In fact, Megaphone Morgans vile mouth roars for the same small minority of the community.
Nevertheless, the reality is that the decisions that our leadership has made over the last couple of years has set our destiny - and the entire community will be, collectively, the losers!
Remember, tomorrow evening at 8 PM is the start of the commission meeting. Resident comments are at the start of the meeting. If your comments pertain to parking at Brafferton or for the unassigned funds, save them for the hearings. There will be two more opportunities to speak. The first opportunity is the public hearing for a 25 car parking lot at Brafferton. The public hearing for the unassigned funds will follow that. If you play your cards right, you can speak three different times. If you can't attend, you can send the commissioners an email, commission@mtlebanon.org or you used to be able to send an e-comment here http://mtlebanon.org/index.aspx?NID=2151 I don't see the link for e-comments at the moment.
Elaine
How political and malicious this "community" has become. It's a disgrace!
It would seem to a casual observer that a majority of the community can only be ruled by a minority of the community IF the majority allows them! No one to blame but ourselves. Granted it will take a couple of years, but the whining has been going on longer than that. Show up and stand up, or shut up. Life is too short to be miserable.
Page one of today's Wall Street Journal, "US Growth Outlook Stuck In Neutral."
So what are our brilliant commissioners, well a least 3 of them, intent on doing-- buying more and more 'stuff'.
8:29 a number of people attempted to do exactly what you are suggesting and failed.
So, what do you recommend, do we draft people, create a PAC, flood either or both of the party committees.
Mr. Brown ran for state office as an independent and lost so it's not like people haven't stepped up.
A lot of us agree with you, but we need a plan, we need an organization if we are ever to get the community back on track.
funny, was going to submit an ecomment, but it is not linked anymore. It was a about 20 mins ago but is now down.
Uh-oh, better hold up some of that money to build bridle trails and maybe a steeple chase in Twin Hills or McNeilly Park.
There is a story on thealmanac.net site about interscholastic equestrians in Peters, Cecil and USC.
How can we let them get ahead of us? How can we be so pedestrian?
Riding boots and crops are definitely Town & Country chic this year, darling!
You're not real gentry unless you have a need for riding jodphurs. It's de rigueur.
You'd think those style conscious, attractive commissioners and lebomag contributors would know that!
Comments disappear here all the time.
Ah yes, polo- the sport of kings!
If it's good enough for the Santa Barbara Polo & Raquet Club, it's should be good enough for us.
Besides the growing sport of arena polo only requires a 150' x 300' facility,...should easily fit in McNeilly Park.
It's interscholastic and a year round sport.
How droll that certain people want passé climbing walls, we've got to start thinking big people, BIG!!!! This is Mt. Lebanon damn it.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polo
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arena_polo
10:43, file a RTK
Yes, you do that, 10:43 AM.
Elaine
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/08/06/despite-budget-cuts-layoff-fears-milwaukee-teachers-fight-taxpayerfunded/cmpid=prn_baynote_Despite_Budget_Cuts,_Layoff_Fears,_Milwaukee_Teachers_Fight_for_Taxpayer-Funded_Viagra
Ecomments are now up on the municipal website. http://mtlebanon.org/index.aspx?NID=2151
Elaine
Latest Lebo ALERT is wrong. Email commission at commission@mtlebanon.org
This is an important notice from LeboALERT.
Provider working to fix e-comment option on website. In meantime, email
commission at: http://www.mtlebanon.org/index.aspx?nid=54
What a coincidence. The Sports Advisory Board meeting a.k.a. Turf Board, experienced technical difficulties and the video portion of the meeting was corrupted. Now, we're having technical difficulties again and it is about turf. Such a coincidence.
Elaine
One would think a SAB member or the PIO would give us a synopsis of the meeting since sports are a primary topic in tonight's commission discussion.
Just to be upfront and transparent.
Do they read ecomments at the meeting?
BTW, I did email the commission my comments but am just wondering what the difference might be. I though I remember them being recorded somewhere or read at the meeting?
July 20, 2013 at 10:47 AM writes:
"Put a couple million into McNeilly we would have a really nice space with fields."
That's it just put a couple million into McNeilly. Hey, a couple of million between friends, what is the big deal. Money is no object for 10:47. They don't give a rats a** about any of the people on the lien list, in affect, they don't want 'those' people on 'their turf' anyway.
Its a lot more than a couple of million 10:47, but that's OK, you never keep score anyway.
They have never read any ecomments at the meetings.
Elaine
Wait, I lied. Dave Brumfield did read something from Dave Franklin before they even had ecomments. It was about the turf petition. Of course.
Elaine
Sorry, but this result was obvious from the time when 4 votes were initially needed....and did not materialize.
Now it will cost the tax payers even more.
ALL of the commissioners failed us!!! A no vote just made it easier to get this agenda approved.
I agree with James in part.
I have a problem with
"2. The remaining funds for turfing a field would be raised by a combination of the school district and private funding"
The school district and the municipality get there funds from from one place...the taxpayer. So simplified the taxpayer is paying a 2/3 share and the sports people are paying 1/3.
Ah yes, and I'm sure someone will be quick to fire in here that the resident sports participants are paying actually paying a 3/3 share and yes, that is indeed a fact.
I see two ways around this.
1. Hold a referendum. If a majority wants turf then perhaps all the taxpayers should pay 100% of the cost of the field. If its at Mellon, 50% chipped in by the school district, 50% by the municipality.
If the referendum doesn't pass, that's the end of turfing plans. We take care of our natural turfed fields and the SAB starts investigating some sort of public/private initiative for McNeilly which is sitting unused.
Forgot to add, if we get a majority supporting turf and the district and municipality install it, the SAB groups that use pay users fees just like the participants do at for tennis, golf, swimming and hockey. Which go strictly to the upkeep, maintenance, security and insurance.
And, AND if the user fees aren't paid the sports Stevie off. No delinquent payments, no forgiveness.
If I show up at the pooland don't pay I don't get in, golf course... Don't pay the greens fee I don't play... tennis, no fee no play.
Wow is auto correct pulling words out of a hat or what!
5:51, Why doesn't the Commission pay the PK fee and let PK raise the money for turf from a $7,000,000 funding. Those who like turf can contribute and the DAS are off the hook for the cost.
Why doesn't the muni give the SAB a 99 year lease on McNeilly-- it's sitting undeveloped and we're already paying for it.
Then the SAB hires PK to do a fundraiser for whatever they want to build.
Everybody wins.
I am not the least bit surprised that the 80+ people who elected to post a comment on this blog in opposition to turf could not find the time in their busy schedule to attend tonight's public hearing and voice their opinions. That pretty much speaks volumes about the overall value of your position. Put it on a blog, but clearly it's not important enough to express in the forum that really matters.
Give it up, Dave. It is not enough that you have this in the bag. You need to rub my nose in it. What a great guy.
Elaine
No Elaine unfortunately he's right!
How did the chambers get packed with crying lacrosse and soccer players? Does anyone believe they showed up on their own? No they were organized.
Unfortunately, there is no organization that stand for fiscal prudence and responsibility. Where's the leadership calling for a show of force? Did Matt ask for support, how about Kelly for her plan?
Both are to be commended for their positions, but even when Brumfield, Bendel and Linfante rallied the troops.
Dave... emails ARE NOT secure and you should watch what you write! Seniors watch OUT! Some see you as not paying your fair share and want you OUT.
1240: I take exception to your comment. And I'm not the least bit surprised the turf supporters couldnt find time in their busy schedules to stay for the entire meeting. But goodness, the arguments in favor of turf were comical. So a big thanks goes out to all who made the pitch.
Brumfield has no plan. He's holding $829,000 in 'over paid taxes' and he's not going to use it for anything until he gets turf and we're worried about kindergarten kids missing a play date! Incredible.
How about... ITS NOT YOUR MONEY, DAVE! We want it back or we want it spent on things like streets, paying down debt. You don't get to sit your ass on it until your get your way.
Enough of this nonsense.
I was thinking about your comment 1:58. I can't attend meetings, because I work nights. But I have listened to a lot of podcasts and sometimes catch the comcast taped version. I have watched residents come in about Washington crosswalk and expert came in to discuss the deplorable condition of our parks & trails. Commissioner Fraasch has put out two proposals on deer and it appears someone has showed leadership by including some of the concerns and needs of this community in a proposal that I am wondering if people thought made too much sense and just thought it would go through since no one else put out a proposal of their own. She even put money assigned to pay 1/3 of a turf project. I am just shocked this morning to see a majority wants to double that just because. Maybe the leadership is on Linfante, Brumield and Bendel to say 1/3 of the funding is a reasonable and generous offer.
10:24 if I'm reading your last sentence correctly, Kelly's plan was an extremely generous offer when you consider that Brumfield and pals have NO plan and after all these years cannot even put a concise figure on the table as to what turf will cost today and over the longterm.
Brumfield-style planning is exactly the kind of thinking that saddled the community with $2 million dollars worth of overpriced, useless property.
But that's OK, kindergarteners have evaluated his position and showed up in force to support it.
Elaine, I'm astounded!
Yesterday, Lebocitizens was an irrelevant Blog comprised of four out-if-touch wingnuts.
This morning 12:40am is not surprised that the 80+ contributors here on turf couldn't find time to attend the commission meeting.
That is amazing. You reach only 4 people one day, 80+ the next. No wonder these people can't come up with a plan. They can't count!
Yes I think that Kelly's plan was absolutely generous and made sense to the general public. My mother isn't going to understand turf or fields or use them. Kelly's proposal gives a majority of residents something that is of need or use to them. That is why the sports people should have jumped on the Robb Hollow plan. Robb Hollow wasn't just for sports it was for everyone. Now we are looking at just sports again. For those that aren't fields related I see no buy in. Kelly was smart about her plan unfortunately the fields people weren't paying attention. 10:24
Mr. Brumfield said that artificial turf is a community asset, therefore, there will not be a fee for its use. The tennis courts, swim center, and ice rink are also community assets, yet there are fees associated with their use. What is the difference between turf and fields and the other community assets?
How he figures... Do his kids use it? If yes then it's free otherwise YOU pay.
I'd love to see the muni or school district install one of those camera feeds focused on Mellon Field, like the one being used on the HS renovation web site.
Then residents could see just how much use Mellon Field gets in the summer and fall. Through the time lapse we could see the use throughout the whole day.
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