Monday, March 6, 2017

Dear Pass Time and groad 570 UPDATED

John Hayes has yet another deer story about Mt. Lebanon in yesterday's paper. Mount Lebanon, Michigan town have different approaches to deer problem The usual commenters to John Hayes' biased reporting include pro-kill Pass Time (we all know who that is) and anti-kill groad 570. Both read my blog. So this post is for the two of you.

My buddy, Pass Time, reminded us of this letter sent by the PA Game Commission to Keith McGill on February 5, 2016. The letter came as a complete surprise to State Representative Dan Miller and Commissioner Kelly Fraasch because of the positive meeting Dan set up with Mt. Lebanon and the PA Game Commission. I kept this voice mail on my phone for over a year, waiting for the right time to share. I believe the time is right.




I am also addressing this post to groad 570 since he had the following to say:
I'm sure if the Mt. Lebanon Commissioners stood together as one and demanded that they be allowed to implement a safe approach to deer mgt in their community, and requested the support from their state representatives, that the PGC would grant them their request.
groad 570, as you can hear above, our state representative and commission did stand together as one and asked for sterilization, but it got us nowhere. When the Game Commission has John Hayes and Susan Morgans working with them, nothing can stop the PA Game Commission. They will NEVER approve sterilization because no deer are being killed. Literally, the PA Game Commission is calling the shots here.

So Pass Time, rest assured that you will continue to get deer killed in Virginia Manor. John Hayes had this as his final statement.
In the coming months, commissioners in Ann Arbor and Mt. Lebanon will vote on including the cost of deer management in their 2018 budgets.
What will the deer management be? According to Tony DeNicola's final "sharpshooting" report,
The Commission will need to decide whether to emphasize added non-traditional lethal management activities in very tightly developed areas or transition to sterilization in these areas of the community. 
What are non-traditional lethal management activities that Tony DeNicola uses?
Mt. Lebanon commissioners strive to please those in Ward 1 and will continue to include deer killing in the 2018 budget. The budget will be approved by the current commissioners: John Bendel, Dave Brumfield, Steve Silverman, Steve McLean, and Kelly Fraasch. Dave Brumfield is not going to be on the commission in January. We're hoping that incumbent Steve Silverman will not win, but he will still be able to vote for more deer killing either way.I'm sure if the Mt. Lebanon Commissioners stood together as one and demanded that they be allowed to implement a safe approach to deer mgt in their community, and requested the support from their state representatives, that the PGC would grant them their request.

Update March 6, 2017 3:29 PM Keith McGill continues to give Nick Meduho one word answers. The cost of the 2017 "sharpshooting" program was $44,868.50. Fifty five deer were killed for $44,868.50. That comes to $815.79 per deer. Of those 55 killed, 22 were fawns, which would have not been born had we sterilized the deer. The foundation was going to pay for the sterilization and would have cost us a minimal amount of money, but the deer haters convinced the commission to continue killing deer at a much higher cost.

28 comments:

E. T. Gillen said...

Remember, I do accept anonymous comments if they are pro-deer.
Elaine

Anonymous said...

Why are the sharpshooting signs still up ? Will there be more culling ?

Anonymous said...

From the township web site "The municipality and White Buffalo, the contractor, agreed that ending the program now was the most fiscally responsible course of action."

Most of the costs were up front. It was the most fiscally responsible course of action FOR THE CONTRACTOR, not the township. $816/deer is not a fiscally responsible course of action at all.

Anonymous said...

Can anyone hazard a guess why Ann Arbor has 5 times the area, nearly 4 times the human population and 3 to 4 times the number of deer, yet in 2014 MTL had more vehicle/deer accidents than Ann Arbor did?

Are their roads better? Are college kids better drivers? Do the deer get out of town when there is a football game?

Jason Margolis said...

6:50pm, I spent 4 years in Ann Arbor for my doctoral program at the U of M. There are some striking similarities between A2 and MTL, and a few important differences.

Similarities would include: a lot of self-righteous people who say they are progressive but how they actually interact with people is quite conservative and reactionary; a lot of money and other resources - especially compared to the nearby areas (Detroit, inner-city Pittsburgh); they love talking about diversity but really only accept it on their own terms (see, Phil Ochs, "Love Me I'm A Liberal" - "I love Puerto Ricans and Negroes - as long as they don't love next door.")

To your question about differences, 6:50pm... it is largely geographic, and a little bit cultural. Both A2 and MTL are in "pro-hunting states" (Michigan, Pennsylvania) but the hunting areas of Michigan are much further away from A2 in upstate Michigan and the Upper Peninsula, compared to hunting in Penn which is accepted more pervasively. Additionally, surrounding A2 on 3 sides is a lot of space. Only to the East, as you head towards Detroit, is it densely populated. Here, MTL is surrounded on all sides by fairly well-populated areas, with only significantly less density to the south - and more so as you go south.

So, my guess to hazard is that there is less of a hunting culture in A2, through no less of a pseudo-liberal self-absorbed culture, and more of a sense that 'if we don't kill them, maybe they will just to Saline or Whitmore Lake." As for why there are fewer accidents, I can tell you that the driving in MTL is much more aggressive than in A2, as everyone seems to think they are on their way to somewhere very important -- LA Fitness, the turf field...

- Jason












Anonymous said...

"East Hampton, N.Y., which recently hired White Buffalo to carry out a sterilization campaign, originally expected to pay $1,000 for every deer that DeNicola's team surgically neuters, but that amount was later negotiated down to about $500 to $700 per deer"

So our brainy commissioners paid White Buffalo $815.79/deer killed by sharpshooters when E. Hampton got deer sterilized for less than $700. Boy, we have some tough negotiators running this community!

Wonder what else we buy at premium prices!

Anonymous said...

We pay premium prices more than anyone knows in this community. Take a look at the high school. Forget what Susan M. Organs and the MTL Ministry of Propaganda tells you to think. Seriously, go take a close look. Would you let a contractor slide if he/she performed work on your home in the subpar manner in which the HS work is turning out? Sure, the job is incomplete, but keep an eye on whether the sloppy finishes are actually corrected or whether they remain. I work in the industry and can attest that MTL is a goldmine for contract work. Why? Because no one cares. It's other peoples' money. It's easier for the worms in the municipal building, particularly those on the full-time payroll to just pay a change order instead of confronting the GC. Look at the concrete work on Cochran Road- a job that should have been completed prior to the first snowfall. Instead, we have 9 months of non-ADA complaint gravel sidewalks, no crosswalks and construction equipment littering miles of the road. But I'm sure no one at 650 Washington Rd. has made a peep. The project, whether it be through the water company, PennDOT or MTL itself, has inconvenienced Mt. Lebanon residents for at least 9 months- but there's no one at the Muni building with the wherewithal to bring the heat. And thus, residents are subject to an unending litany of over-budget, incomplete projects that don't seem to be a problem for surrounding communities. It's amateur hour, but no one wants you to know it. Thankfully, we have some new choices in the near future that will crack the whip and minimize premium pricing and other wasteful spending in this community.

- Zeke the Plumber

E. T. Gillen said...

It IS amateur hour, Zeke. Nobody knew what was going on with White Buffalo. In fact, they can't even count to three. Check out Tony DeNicola's deer management plan submitted 3 September 2013. How is it we just completed Year 2?

They can't report deer/car collisions fairly. You're damn right deer/car collisions escalated. That is because the TOTAL car collisions went through the roof. What is the percentage of deer/car collisions to total car collisions? THAT is the number we should be looking at. Is it still 8%? Did it increase? Decrease? We'll never know.

Take the swimming pool. It was peeling paint in the first month it opened! We also ended up in court over that because of MTL's screw up.

Ask any question at a commission meeting. You will most like like hear "We don't have that information." Or Dave Brumfield will thank the citizen without answering any questions. People are too intimidated or nervous and leave the microphone without getting their questions answered. Watch the videos!

If the cost of killing deer using traditional lethal methods was over $800/deer, I shutter to think what the costs will be when Tony resorts to trap and shoot or having friends drive around in ATVs to scare the deer toward the tree stands.

Are people starting to understand what we have been saying all these years?
Elaine

E. T. Gillen said...

*likely hear.
Elaine

Richard Gideon said...

Of course East Hampton got a negotiated deal! The people who live out there, and those in elected office, aren't used to being jerked around or treated like suckers. There's enough money in East Hampton to buy Mt. Lebanon, lock, stock, and school district. Along with Broadway, movie, and TV stars, the Hamptons have one of the highest concentrations of financial people in the USA. In all fairness, not every person in East Hampton Township is rich - I should know, I used to live there - but the vast majority know a what a bad deal is and how to avoid it.

Anonymous said...

Why would anyone negotiate a good deal on deer or anything else, if your raise is almost guaranteed and no one is checking time sheets.

Anonymous said...

We might want to pay really close attention to the next trash contract because something is really beginning to smell rotten here.

From a 2014 article:

"DeNicola sympathizes with those upset by the expense of sterilization.
The cost for a White Buffalo deer-killing operation ranges from $200-$400 per animal, depending on things like terrain and road access. "You come to the conclusion that lethal is more effective, more efficient," he said."

https://www.google.com/amp/www.courant.com/politics/hc-white-buffalo-10-2014-20141027-story,amp.html

I'm no woodsman, but I'm pretty sure no one would call any Mt. Lebanon terrain rough or hazardous especially donated yards and road access is about as accessible as you can get.

So why are we paying this guy over $800/deer for a "White Buffalo deer-killing operation?"

E. T. Gillen said...

7:11 AM, the article that you linked makes me ill, for so many reasons. DeNicola quotes the same $200-$400 per animal cost in his September 3, 2013 deer management plan that I shared in my 6:22 PM comment above. Truly bait-and-switch!

"'It's just like the animal rights people,' DeNicola said of the complaints from Redding-area hunters. 'It's a handful of … super-vocal, very uninformed individuals. … You cannot provide any logic or facts – they already have their minds made up."'

I am neither a hunter or animal rights person. I am a "human rights" person who is trying to fight that all the way to the PA Supreme Court! There is zero transparency in what this creep is doing. Did you know that a RTK was filed for the contents of the trail cameras that Tony billed us and there was nothing? Do a Google search and you will find how he tampered with evidence in the past, which resulted in a lawsuit. He is a crook.

In Princeton, NJ, "Lawsuits were filed by residents against the township that dragged on for years. DeNicola said local officials spent about $250,000 in legal fees." Here in Mt. Lebanon, local officials spend nothing while a widowed senior citizen spends thousands.

I am sickened by "Almost exclusively, DeNicola shoots deer at night, luring them to bait stations." Here in Mt. Lebanon, he likes to start a half hour after elementary school children are dismissed from school. He brags about his "silencers, high-powered scopes and infrared thermal imaging equipment of the sort developed for Navy Seal teams." Why would anyone need infrared thermal imaging equipment at 4:00 PM? Gee, we should have hired Tony to take out Bin Ladin.

He thinks about "human safety." Not at 4 PM!

And the coup de gras, "DeNicola said he has "no emotion" when he shoots a deer or other animal. He compares it to a veterinarian euthanizing a cat or dog. " He is a creep who has our commissioners wrapped around his little finger.
Elaine

Anonymous said...

Of course there was nothing from the trail cameras! Did you really think there would be.

That's the way things work here, don't ya know.

We start or foot the bill for things like a Capital Campaign, field advertising signs, trail cameras, cell phones, archery supplies, parking apps, Look Up signs, NY Field Trips and there is never an audit or an inquiry to see if any of it is worth it.

Anonymous said...

I guess DeNicola and our commissioners thought Scott Township officials were uninformed and illogical when they said they didn't want hunting in Twin Hills Park.

Who looks uninformed and illogical now!

But we'll vote the commissioners back won't we.

E. T. Gillen said...

8:54 AM, there are plenty of inquiries. No answers, but plenty of attitude.
Elaine

Anonymous said...

That's what I meant. The taxpayers footing the bills do indeed ask questions.

E. T. Gillen said...

March 6 at 4:15 PM, I wanted to follow up on your question. The "sharpshooting" signs have been removed. I noticed that yesterday, soon after your question was submitted. Good work, Public Works!
Elaine

Anonymous said...

Regarding the trail cameras and no images...

http://www.sharkonline.org/index.php/deer-kills/46-metro-parks-slaughter-in-akron-ohio/654-anthony-denicola-settles

"It has taken over five years and an approaching trial, but Anthony DeNicola and his White Buffalo group of animal serial killers have finally seen the light, and offered SHARK a settlement $17,500 for purposely and illegally deleting SHARK's video recorders at a government deer slaughter in the Metro Parks. With a trial date approaching, Mr. DeNicola apparently realized that he was going to be very publicly excoriated before the world."

Apparently someone may have a habit of deleting images from things like video recorders.

Anonymous said...

So with over 100 deer per sq mi and with "expert hunters" placing the trail cameras where one would expect they believe there are deer we can conclude one of two things since there no images.

1. We have no deer and therefore don't need any more culling or DeNicola's services

Or

2. Somebody is lying

Anonymous said...

There is a third possibility!

The cameras were defective and we shouldn't be paying for them!

Anonymous said...

Another lawsuit that DeNicola settled - In 2008, White Buffalo and the City of Solon, Ohio settled a lawsuit with resident Belinda Geiger for $25,000. According to The Solon Herald Sun, Geiger claimed "the city and White Buffalo conspired unlawfully to silence her and deprive her of her right to free speech."

E. T. Gillen said...

Tony and MTL have learned how to get around that since 2008. Now, it costs me thousands and I can't get reimbursed, no matter the outcome of the case. Instead of depriving me of my right to free speech, they are depriving me of my right to know.
Elaine

E. T. Gillen said...

I should say, "our" right to know. I am not the only one who is being deprived of our rights.
Elaine

Anonymous said...

There wasn't one picture from those trail cameras?!!!!

That's bull!

E. T. Gillen said...

I posted the Metro Parks video on my website, lebocitizens.com. I also have shared links to other videos of Tony's work on this blog. He is baaaaaaad news, but nobody from the municipal building seems to listen or care.

The quote below actually describes our commissioners, manager, and PIO.

"'It's just like the animal rights people,' DeNicola said of the complaints from Redding-area hunters. 'It's a handful of … super-vocal, very uninformed individuals. … You cannot provide any logic or facts – they already have their minds made up."'

Elaine

Anonymous said...

Read this!
Looks like the next step will be trap and shoot with bolt guns!

But several paragraphs down DeNicola expert hunter uses warm weather as an excuse for not bagging his expected limit.

http://www.refugeforums.com/refuge/threads/from-the-antis-nj-protests-against-deer-hunt-turn-nasty.35586/

E. T. Gillen said...

Yes, I know!!!! I listed that as one of the "non-traditional lethal methods." Think Merlin the Magnificent!!!!

And his BS excuse about warm weather doesn't seem to slow down archers who start hunting in September!
Elaine