There may be another Tax Increment Financing (TIF) in our future. According to the Trib, T line project gets scaled-back ideas in Mt. Lebanon, the development costs could be reduced with the use of TIFs.
Specifically, the analysis showed a $22.3 million “gap” between cost and value for such a development, said Dan Santoro, a vice president who runs Delta's office in Pine.We have heard "TIF" mentioned over the Zamagias property across from St. Bernard's Church. Zamagias has defaulted and now the State (we, taxpayers) is stuck with the debt. From Wikipedia:
“There's no developer in the world who would come in and cover those costs,” he said, noting that grants or tools such as tax increment financing could close the gap slightly.
Although the TIF method has been discontinued in the state it began in, California, thousands of TIF districts still currently operate nationwide in the US, from small and mid-sized cities, to the State of California which will be paying off debt on old TIFs for years to come. As of 2008, California had over four hundred TIF districts with an aggregate of over $10 billion per year in revenues, over $28 billion of long-term debt, and over $674 billion of assessed land valuation.[2] TIF began in California in 1952, but the state has currently discontinued the use of them due to a couple of lawsuits.I was not aware of this, but according to the Trib, the public can learn more about proposals for the site and make suggestions at a 6 p.m. hearing on March 10 in the commission chambers at the municipal building.
Update February 22, 2014 11:50 AM I had emailed the commissioners about the March 10 hearing, as reported by the Trib. Here is some more information from Eric Milliron, Economic Development Officer.
Commissioner Bendel requested that I email you regarding the public meeting on garnering community input on March 10th. I am the staff lead on this effort and can supply you with the most up to date information.
First, thank you for your interest in this project. I appreciate you wanting to know more about the meeting. I think it is important to make a clarification. The meeting is not a hearing. Rather, it is an opportunity for residents/stakeholders to provide valuable input towards the first of two Requests for Proposals (RFPs) to the development community. We are seeking information about what values we have in Mt. Lebanon for a project around the Mt. Lebanon T Station. Values is a broad term, but some issues that might arise are scale/massing of potential project, traffic impacts, parking, sustainability targets, etc.
There is a front page link to information on this meeting at => http://mtlebanon.org/ This link will provide additional information.
The meeting will be structured in the following format:
1. Brief History + Overview of Current Efforts at the proposed development site;
2. Review of relevant studies => TRID, AECOM Engineering Study and most recently the Delta Development market analysis (which will be a part of said RFP)
3. Open Discussion with audience to understand matters of interest.
4. Break Out Session(s) => We will aggregate matters of interest and break the audience into smaller working groups to develop thoughts in a digestible manner. Many of these thoughts could then be included in the RFP.
The goal of this session is to provide the development community an understanding of what the community expects from any potential project. Clearly, this information will be valuable to not only the development community, but Municipal officials as we work with all groups to develop around the aforementioned site. I expect that the product from this session will be brought to the Commission for their review and input. The information will also be brought to the Economic Development Council (EDC). The RFP crafted will be publicly advertised and will be found on the Municipal website. I'd be happy to let you know when this happens. If I had to guess (and I don't like guessing...) I'd say this should happen late March.
Based on the proposals received a second RFP will be issued that would expect more analysis from any potential developer.
This meeting is the first step in a longer journey to actualizing a good project that has the potential to not only offer new product in our central core, but potentially act as a catalyst for additional renovations and projects (where feasible).
There will be other public meetings as things move forward.
Following is a link to my presentation to the Commission on 1.14.14 => http://mtlebanon.granicus.com/MediaPlayer.php?view_id=3&clip_id=104&meta_id=3479 (minute 47 is where I discuss the meeting + RFP process).
If anyone has questions, here is Eric's contact information.
36 comments:
Of course the following comments from the Trib article justify a $27 million dollar project!
"“I think (the garage) would be a good idea,” said Christopher Weis, 21, of Mt. Lebanon as he waited for a train Monday. “Sometimes, parking Uptown can be a bit of an issue, so more parking would be good.”
[ So the plan is to build a parking garage in the $27 million plan that developers won't touch with a ten foot pole or build some townhomes and eliminate the 20 or so parking spaces that already exist. Millron said the low density option includes 42 apts. and 11 townhouses including 56 parking spaces. If each apt. and townhouse resident have 1 car, Mr. Weis looses 17 parking spots.]
Pam Merkle, 44, of Mt. Lebanon, catches a bus at the station four times a day and said she'd welcome a new facility with a more sheltered waiting area. But she said the cost could be passed on to taxpayers if the municipality has to sweeten the deal for developers.
[Ms. Merkle, where are you going to shelter waiting for buses that don't stop there-- on a townhouse's front stoop?]
“I think it would bring more people and money to Mt. Lebanon, but it could also bring homeowners' taxes up,” she said.
[Could bring homeowners taxes up... you can bet it will.]
“The condos could be popular... we have a lot of people around here who want to live in Mt. Lebanon; it's a great area,” said Jessica Johns, a worker at Orbis Caffe on Washington Road, above the proposed development.
[Jessica, have you been asleep? Two hundred yards up the street a condo project flew like a lead ballon! I didn't see A LOT od people lined up to live in Mt. Lebanon, in fact I heard there wasn't one that put money down on a condo. Of course, you'd love more customers at the Orbis Caffe, personally I don't think its up to taxpayers to bring them to you.]
if no developer, people that invest money to make money wouldn't touch this why should taxpayers?
Maybe if we cut taxes for everyone, private developers could see the profitabilty and develop on their own dime.
Here's another TIF reality in good ol' PA. A law was passed in Harrisburg...you know, the bankrupt center of political corruption...several years ago that required an annual report on the status and effectiveness of TIF's in PA. Of course, no such reports have been made. The Harrisburg reason given, believe it or not, is that there has been no legislation creating the funding or mechanism necessary to create such reports. And given full recognition of such a deficiency, the PA legislature has done absolutely nothing to correct it.
This can be confirmed by an Allegheny Institute for Public Policy published "Policy Brief".
Here is the link to the Allegheny Institute Policy Brief mentioned by 12:48 PM.
Why No State Reports on the TIF Program?
Elaine
It seems like the Shannon Transit Village TOD at the Castle Shannon LRT Station may go forward. It was to start last November, but there was a hang-up with property lines or something like that. It is already TIF approved with a PA grant to boot. The developer has a questionable reputation because he reportedly never puts his own money into projects.
ARE THE COMMISSIONERS KIDDING?
According to The Trib they get a report like this:
"When combined with the cost to build a seven-story tower with 100 or 160 apartments and 10,000 square feet of retail space, high-density options likely would cost more to build and run than they would return in rent, Delta concluded.
Specifically, the analysis showed a $22.3 million “gap” between cost and value for such a development, said Dan Santoro, a vice president who runs Delta's office in Pine.
“There's no developer in the world who would come in and cover those costs,” he said, noting that grants or tools such as tax increment financing could close the gap slightly."
Apparently, someone got the bright idea that Lebo needed a high-rise, commercial space and another parking garage.
That turns out to be an expensive boondoggle that would cost more to build and run than it would make, so they can that idea and what is the brilliant replacement they come up with... "lets build a few apartments and townhouses and eliminate parking spaces, convenient T rider drop off/pick up and bus transfer loading spaces."
One day we need grandiose condos, a parking garage, retail spaces... on another- "oh shit, we have to build something, we reminded them about those goofy "air rights." "Build something, anything long as it sounds reasonable or else we'll look like fools for buying "air rights!" "Hey,, what the hell taxpayers are stupid, they'll buy into anything in the bubble!"
Kind of like- "we need more fields... buy the McNeilly property... no we don't need more fields... we need to turf fields we already have!"
Yes indeed; a lot of people want to live in Mt. Lebanon. You've probably seen all the "tent cities" containing multi-millionairs who can't wait to live in Lebo that have sprung up in bordering communities. On my way home from work I had to push through a throng of BMW families in USC who are camped on Painter's Run, awaiting those Cedar Boulevard fields to be turfed. Every morning I have to shoo away hordes of real estate agents who want me to sell my house and get the hell out. They leave their cards, flyers, boxes of chocolates, bottles of wine, and blank counter checks on my doorstep. One morning I discovered I had left my car unlocked overnight in the driveway with the keys in the ignition. An agent had placed a dozen roses and $50 for gas on the seat. Last evening a canvasser stopped by with a petition from the MLHMMDSCA (Mt. Lebanon Homeless Millionaires' McNeilly Domed Sports Complex Association), requesting my signature and a contribution in order to develop McNeilly Park into an indoor turfed sports complex and farmer's market. I signed it: Bill Zellers.
If this T development is such a idea-- rather than a TIF why don't they sell shares in the project?
Let people invest in it rather than stealing from them by giving away their tax dollars.
It how this nation developed its early electric system, the railroads and telephone system.
Mt. Lebanon isn't blighted. Our commissioners and school directors keep proclaiming that buying property here is a great investment. So let investors--- invest!
Form the MTL T Station Development Corp. Let everybody get rich, not just the 1%ers!
Here's how things used to work in the good old USofA.
"Kennywood History
Founded in 1898 as a small trolley park near Pittsburgh, Kennywood was begun by the Monongahela Street Railway Company, which was controlled by Andrew Mellon. Today's Kennywood still contains two major buildings dating from 1898 -- a carousel pavilion and a restaurant (originally the Casino).
At the turn of the century, Kennywood was engaged in a fierce battle for survival with about a dozen other trolley parks and amusement resorts in Western Pennsylvania. The Pittsburgh Street Railway Company wanted to get out of the amusement park business in 1902 so it subleased the park to first a Boston Company and later to a group from Aspinwall. In 1906, Pittsburgh Railway Company assigned its lease to A.S. McSwigan and Frederick W. Henninger."
We can't invest in PAT any more than we already do thru government subsidies (from tax dollars), but we could invest in the 'MTL T-Air Space Development Corp.
Rather than giving away TIFs-- start a private development company. Let people that think this is such a brilliant scheme put 'their' money into it by buying stock.
Just think residents, you could join the ranks of the nations 1%ers by investing in Mt. Lebanon property. Well not land property so much as 'air' property. It's the American dream.
Our generous commissioners, always anxious to give things away for 'crown jewels' could get the ball rolling by deeding the air rights over to the MTLTAS Corp.
Why is this report not on the Municipal website tonight, on either the TOD homepage link or the Commercial District or Economic Development office links ?
The Trib has it, why not friggin' taxpayers ?
Ask the PIO, 6:15.
We get articles about twins, somebody's snapshots of Pittsburgh, skiers, critques of grocery store shoppers, green agendas, but no articles on the environmental hazards connected with turf or the negative consequences of TIFs.
Does anyone know the current occupancy rate of the apartment buildings and office/retail space on Washington Rd? If the occupancy rate is 95-100% perhaps we need more apartments and or office/retail space on Washington Rd. If the occupancy rate is less than that perhaps we don't.
Regardless 8:34 of the occupency rates-did government play a financial role in the development of any of those properties?
Do you really want to underwrite condos, apartments or townhouses? Did anyone cut you a tax break on your Lebo home?
"Tax increment financing, or TIF, is bad public policy amounting to welfare for the wealthy"
— The Baltimore Sun
To 8:46 - I really don't know if the government played a financial role in the development of any property on Washington Rd. If they did, I would not be happy about it and I also will not be happy if a TIF is granted for the TOD district. The point I was trying to make is unless we know the occupancy rate of the space available now we won't know if the project they are proposing is feasible or not. I suspect that the occupancy rate is not at capacity, therefore I don't think this project is a good bet. If I am wrong and we do need more capacity for Washington Rd then a private developer with financial backing from private individuals or a bank should proceed with the plan without any government ie taxpayer help. Clear enough, now?
If Mt Lebanon is so hard up that we need to come up with plans for more development to raise revenue, why are all of the remaining unassigned funds going into turf?
Who is brainwashing our Commissioners to think like this? I did see that the Allegheny County Comprehensive Plan emphasizes transit-oriented development, and that Dormont has their own plan, but I would think some of the other unfinished projects like McNeilly and the Zamagias property would come first.
One last thing: I suspect that the influence of Gateway Engineers should not be overlooked. They get paid for all the plans they develop. They are interested in "building, building, building". If this municipality invested as much time and energy into a municipal organic gardening firm as they did Gateway, maybe we'd have better natural fields, more and healthier trees, cleaner air & water, and happier people. And we'd have fewer plans to develop AIR space.
9:54 I wasn't arguing with you, yes we need to know if there is actually a demand that needs to be filled as you question.
I was only pointing out that even if we were at 100% capacity, is it government's duty to create more.
The Zamagias flop would suggest even with TIF support no one wanted more expensive condos.
The law of supply and demand apply here.
No private developer should EVER take information developed by Gateway Engineers seriously. Not with investor money on the line. No way.
TOD's are the next big thing in government circles. Everyone is jumping on the bandwagon in support of "sustainable development". Suburbs and cars are bad and high-density development near mass transit is good. It's the in thing with the global warming crowd. If it's such a good idea, let the free market support it. If people really want to live in high density urban areas then they will flock to these developments. If they want open space, acres of land, prefer private transportation to public transportation and don't want to live on top of their neighbors, they will continue to flock to suburbs such as USC, Peters, Pine Township etc.
The root of the problem isn't with TIF - the root of the problem is that our government is too big, too expensive and too inefficient.
Face it, we're kidding ourselves to think that we can use TIF or any kind of subsidy that will magically inflate property values or stimulate economic growth to an extent that will cover the lavish and exorbitant salaries and benefits of government employees, and I am not even going to start on the Pensions!
Mt Lebanon doesn't need smartass municipal employees, a community organ or a country club view of the world from the Board Room of the Law Office. Mt Lebanon does need to get it's act together, pick-up a broom, clean itself up and learn how to build intrinsic value by living within its means.
Just proves that democrats in the past 20 years undid what republicans built the prior 80 years. Dave B. please tell the taxpayers how many of these "units" are to be handed over to HUD for public housing. Maybe you should quit bragging so much at work!
Beware of Dem's push for "affordable housing" in a TOD boondoggle project that would allegedly "justify" government subsidies, be they TIF's, LERDA'S and or government grants.
While at it, ask our local C.O.P. about the growing problems with occupants of local group homes in/around downtown Lebo.
This thread presents an excellent opportunity to recommend a review of the hit Netflix TV show, "House of Cards," by Professor Steven Horwitz, Professor of Economics -
St. Lawrence University.
"Unlike so many television shows, House of Cards shows how politicians use their power to help themselves and their friends – not the people who elected them." - LearnLiberty.org
See "Frank Underwood’s Top 3 Lessons for the Voting Public | House of Cards Review" at http://www.learnliberty.org/videos/1974/.
Professor Horwitz's lesson applies to local politicians as well as those in the national spotlight.
Actually, 846, government does play a small role in housing in the bubble. Funny how we've never seen a story in our "official" publication about section 8 housing and just how prolific it is.
10:57, yes that is true about Section 8 housing, but you are comparing apples to oranges.
Here in the bubble, I don't believe anyone has - as of yet - purpose built Section 8 housing.
5:40 insinuates though we may be on the cusp of starting to.
Love "Underwood's Top 3 Lessons for the Voting Public," Richard!
145, Im not talking about new housing. Im talking about the low income, government subsidized housing that already exists here.
1:45 PM - the massive Twin Towers apartment buildings in the 300 block of Washington Road, just north of Bower Hill, is a Section 8 facility, I believe. We also have a number of group homes in/around downtown Mt. Lebanon.
Problems with group home residents is nothing new. Including a house burning to the ground in the 70's. But I don't quite remember when it was, maybe the early 80's a developer wanted to build a bunch of low-income housing in the area around the Post Office on Castle Shannon Blvd. A really vocal population of Mt Lebanonites demanded the project proceed because Mt Lebanon was not diverse enough. It even went as far a people wanting the Kossman property to be allowed as ONLY HUD low-income development. I remember my parents fighting it as then our home would have backed it. They were called racist and worse. But in order to get Federal breaks and funds so many units have to be set aside as low-income. Ask Baldwin how all that has worked out for them as for as their schools go.
How many Sanders houses are in Mt Lebanon? Just learned about that mess... Wow!
There are two within 500 feet of me. At one time, there were eleven or so, but I think we are down to seven.
Elaine
5:36, I'm not arguing against you that Section 8 housing, government subsidized housing exist in Mt. Lebanon. I know it does.
We're talking about development around the T stop.
I don't know that there are plans for Section 8 housing in that plan or not, but if it is taxpayers should be made fully aware of it before the commissioners go around granting TIFs to some developer!
I'm against the municipality handing over any breaks for developers.
If its such a great idea the freemarket will determine its viability.
As Dan Santoro claims, there's no way this project will make money without goverment help.
Where does government get its money... from taxpayers!
So is there anyone in this community so rich that they're willing to pay higher property taxes so somebody else gets a free ride?
I updated this post with information from Mt. Lebanon's Economic Development Officer, Eric Milliron. The meeting on March 10 is not a hearing, as reported. It will be an informational meeting.
Elaine
EDO Milliron is conducting an informational meeting with boards and citizens.
Didn't Brumfield say discussion sessions like this weren't necessary in the turf meeting?
Why is the Delta Development report not posted on the muni website ? It was completed last year, claims Eric.
How in the hell can residents and taxpayers make informed opinions and recommendations without the relevant facts and background ?
Q: How does construction of a few condos and apartments - the less dense option - justify the purchase of the "air rights" above the T station?
Or were the purchase of those rights just another waste of hardearned tax payers dollars like the Twin Hills and McNeilly follies.
Imagine buying a condo in front of the T and a few years later some new brilliant politician comes along and says-- "we bought these air rights over the T, we really should put up a 12 story high rise and parking garage there." Wouldn't you just love that towering outside your window.
Also, the T station works in its present configuration. Building apartments in front of it inconveniences everyone else that drops off or picks up someone using the T now.
The Trib has two articles today which tie in with this topic and my RTK concerning artificial turf.
State financing authority operations shrouded in secrecy
Shhhhhh! Secret!:The Commonwealth Financing Authority
Elaine
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